I seriously doubt its the wheel bearings. You would hear them and they would not make the rotor hot. The rotor gets rid of a lot of heat. Sounds like the the pads are binding. I would take it to a shop that does a lot of brakes.

 

Thanks for the reply. I forgot to mention I've also tried filing the tabs on the pads with a metal file. Not a lot; just enough to remove the paint; maybe a 16th of an inch.

 

There's one thing causing the extreme heat, friction. Your right wheel should not be that hot, IMHO.

When you say you've replaced the calipers, you mean the whole caliper assembly, pistons etc?? That is a lot of money.

My money is on or more of the 2 pistons (not sure if you have 1 or 2 piston calipers on your fronts) sticking in their bores intermittently and binding the pads on. Also highly probable is a warped disc /rotor.

I would strip everything out on your right hand side, and consider swapping discs / rotors to the other opposite side hub to see if they are the problem.

 

Yep, I replaced the whole calipers. They have two pistons each.

I would strip everything out on your right hand side, and consider swapping discs / rotors to the other opposite side hub to see if they are the problem.

That's an interesting idea. I'm pretty sure the calipers are not interchangeable; nor are the brake hoses. But the pads and rotors are, I believe.

If rotor were warped, wouldn't I feel it?

Thanks for your reply.

 

Has the car had any damage or accidents affecting the front right side? I ask because I do know of a case where the brakes were overheating and it turned out to be a faulty caliper support bracket. I would check that carefully, too.

Carefully examine your pads - the wear, of course, should be completely equal on both of them. Anything else points to a problem.

 

No accidents or damage. 130k miles, by the way. No obvious difference in the pad wear. I should have checked them with a micrometer, but didn't. Maybe I'll do that when I swap them to the left side as ForesterCub suggested.

How would I check the caliper support bracket? I didn't notice anything amiss when I replaced the calipers.

 

I don't think a micrometer is required; it would be immediately obvious in uneven pad wear if the problem was showing up there.

Re the support bracket - maybe take the left hand one off and compare the two to begin with. Then just case of making sure that the support bracket and the caliper are lining up correctly and that everything is true. Torque for my front caliper support bolts is 59 ft lb, I'm not sure if it's the same for you.

Also, have a look at your discs / rotors next time you get a high temp reading. They sould be showing signs of 'blueing' at 300F + At least if you know the discs are heating too, it might help narrow down the cause of all this.

I take it your brake fluid is recent and good quality? It must be because you bled it all when you swapped out the calipers, right?

 

I'd say either your left brake isnt doing enough or your right ones are stuck.

I had to take an angle grinder to my pads.
They would hang up on the 2013 outback.. since that brake job if I'm not using oem pads I really check the fit and movement.

also what grease did you use on the pads? if its silicone grease(what you use on slider pins) it washes off really easy.

Use something with solid lube ie pastelub
https://goodson.com/products/bpl-2400-pastelub-brake-lubricant
on the pad contact points (back of pad and ears)
Works quite well up here in the salt belt.

Silglyde works good on caliper pins.

Are you sure your caliper pins are in the correct spots.. one should be a guide pin with rubber the other is all metal(iirc)

 

Thanks for your reply. I would say fault is definitely on right side.

The first time I cleaned and lubed the slide pins, I used Sil-Glyde. The lower pin is the one with rubber. After reading that one can use too much lube, I cleaned and lubed them with 3M Silicone Paste #08946 . When I replaced the calipers, they came with pre-lubed and installed slide pins. I didn't mess with them. In all 3 cases, intermittent high temps on right side persisted, so I'm pretty sure it's not the slide pins. And since I replaced the calipers, it's not the pistons.

I used Permatex Aluminum Anti-Seize Lubricant #80078 on the pad tabs. I did not use any lube on the back of the pads where they contact the pistons. I have read mixed advice on that. Some claim it is unnecessary and only attracts dirt. IIRC, the pad manufacturer recommended against any lube or quiet on the backs of the pads. By the way, the brakes are not squealing or chattering at all.

How loose should the pads be in their brackets? I filed them until they are easy to push out, but do not fall out on their own. I am afraid that if I file them down too much, they will skew and bind.

I meant to say, if you still draw a blank on this problem, definitely consider taking your car to Andrew Tech in Maryland. They really are a fantastic independent Subaru shop. Probably the best I've ever come across and I don't say that lightly.

Thanks again for your reply. Will keep Andrew Tech in mind. A reliable mechanic is as good as gold; maybe better!

Re the support bracket - maybe take the left hand one off and compare the two to begin with. Then just case of making sure that the support bracket and the caliper are lining up correctly and that everything is true. Torque for my front caliper support bolts is 59 ft lb, I'm not sure if it's the same for you.

When I installed the calipers I did tighten to specs.
Caliper Supports: 80 N-m (59 ft-lb)
Caliper Body: 38 N-m (28 ft-lb)
Brake Hose: 18 N-m (13.0 ft-lb)

Also, have a look at your discs / rotors next time you get a high temp reading. They sould be showing signs of 'blueing' at 300F + At least if you know the discs are heating too, it might help narrow down the cause of all this.

I have noticed a slight blueing of the rotors a couple of times. Difficult to tell for sure because I'm looking at the rotors through the gaps in the wheel. There's no question about it though, on occasion, but not consistently, the right rotors are getting quite hot. Not hot enough to produce a sense of urgency, but hot enough that it tells me something is not quite right.

I take it your brake fluid is recent and good quality? It must be because you bled it all when you swapped out the calipers, right?

Brand new Valvoline DOT 3&4 Synthetic. Specs call for DOT 3. I'm given to understand that DOT 4 is just as good. I installed OAKOS Speed Bleeders #SB7100-Set and purged all 4 lines. Haven't noticed any softness or collapse when braking.

I'm a bit encouraged that nobody is focusing on ABS or wheel bearings. Both would be a challenge and/or expensive to pursue.

When the weather warms, I intend to swap the rotors and pads as you suggest. If the problem moves with them (or not), then I'll know better where to focus.

 

I meant to say, if you still draw a blank on this problem, definitely consider taking your car to Andrew Tech in Maryland. They really are a fantastic independent Subaru shop. Probably the best I've ever come across and I don't say that lightly.

 

being its a 2002, you might have some brake hose deterioration or something more exotic happening.

If the car was being lightly driven in those temp checks definitely agree its a right side issue.

 

I would honestly not put those rotors back on your car. It looks like a serious surface failure and it's not worth the time, money and safety trying to fix it.

I would buy a new pair of rotors and see what, if any, difference it makes to your heat issue. If your pads show even wear then I'd just stick to replacing the rotors for now. If the pads are badly worn or unevenly worn, replace them.

Uneven wear will usually point to things like sticking guide pins etc so take the opportunity to service your caliper, guide pins, boots, etc. But please don't use those rotors on your car!!

 

Thank you for the advice. I've ordered Centric 120.47012 Premium rotors with E-coating. Rest easy.

The pads looked fine.

Since the Wearever rotors don't seem to have stood up very well, I don't think it would be worth replacing them with the same thing and end up right back where I am now a year or so from now. Live and learn. :wink2:

 

I think the warranty on those rotors is 2 years so if you have your receipt you may be able to swap them for a new set

 

Want to finish out this thread with my findings. Might prove useful to someone in the future.

I replaced the Wearever rotors with new Centric 120.47012 Premium rotors with E-coating. Since then, the temps have been even on both sides and rarely exceed 140 F. So problem solved, but I don't have a good explanation why. To summarize, about 2 years ago I replaced the rotors and pads (Wearever YH145207 Rotor. Wearever Platinum Profession Ceramic Brake Pads PXD721H) on my 2002 Forester S. After about 9 months I noticed the right front calipers and wheels were getting quite hot. Sometimes, so hot one could not leave one's hand on the wheel without burning. The problem was intermittent, but when it showed, it was consistently hotter on the right side. Temperatures sometimes exceeded 300 F. The brakes were working fine. No pull to the side when braking or not. No vibration, braking or not.

The things I tried that did NOT solve the problem:

1. Clean and lube slider pins. Twice. 3M Silicone Paste.
2. Replace calipers, including pistons. Both sides.
3. Replace brake hose on right side wheel well.
4. File pad tabs. Just enough to remove the paint; maybe a 16th of an inch.

Replacing the rotors with the new Centric rotors DID solve the problem.

Now one might be inclined to somehow believe that Wearever rotors are defective, but I have trouble with that conclusion. There was no vibration or pulling, or excessive pad wear. They did have the scratches on them I showed in one of my previous posts, but I find it hard to believe those were responsible for the problem.

So in the end, I'm not sure what was truly the cause of the problem, but it is solved now.

 

@GaryGood thank you for updating your thread with the solution! I added "SOLVED!" to your thread title.

Bobby...

['07 FSXT Member Journal] ['03 X Member Journal]

 

Hi, I had the same issue with my Subaru Forester 2013 X Premium, but in this case it was the left front side wheel, sometime both front, sometimes rear, but mostly all the time the left front side. Sometimes it happen only when the weather was really hot, or after long trips. I started to feel afraid to drive because it will break either the transmission or the all wheel drive system. MPG went down obviuosly when this happen. A way to know when it was happening besides the MPG was by having the car in a slight inclination or hill like when taking and exit on the HW, and put in neutral, the car didnt slide down at all. By Reading blogs and discussions threads, I though were the calipers, or collapsed brake hoses, wheel bearings, pads, rotors, you named. Logic states that if the master cilinder was responsible the 2 either front or rear should fail but not just one. So I though it was the ABS module the failure and this is not cheap. However I was able to find a used fully functional one the same part number and I installed. Turn out that the issue finally was the Master cilinder. When I took it out all the inside of the brake booster was a mess. After It was replaced everything works beatiful. I am affraid this is an issue I was having for years and I didnt notice until the burn smell and overheating wheel got worst, a defective Master Cilinder, which also contribute to the excesive oil comsuption (plus the engine issues) and ended with a total engine failure on this GEN model which is well known. And I think that because strangely sometimes I was getting really good mpg readings, and sometimes dont, even using the best gasoline, since I bought it new