2018 Forester vs 2019 redesign, NA vs XT - Subaru Forester Owners Forum
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 12:14 PM Thread Starter
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Question 2018 Forester vs 2019 redesign, NA vs XT

I went out and test drove a 2018 Touring today and I have to say, I loved almost everything about it. Really enjoyed the way it drove, it wasn't too noisy, and it wasn't over-designed. I could go on but I'll keep it short and sweet. Anyway, I know that Subaru runs a five year cycle on their cars on the Forester should be up for the SGP in 2019 as well as a redesigned look inside and out, and honestly if they can do to the Forester what they did to the Impreza, I think it will be worth the wait. Wouldn't have an issue getting one now, but it's missing some things I'd like to have, one of those being android auto, and since the 2018 Outback has it now, I figure it's only a matter of time for the Forester, hopefully with the 2019 redesign to bring it into the "modern age," so to speak. Also, since the Forester traditionally runs on the Impreza platform, and the Impreza having seen an increase in size, I don't think it's too crazy to think the Forester may see a slight bump in size as well? That would not be a bummer for me, seeing as I'm 6'6" and have a bad lower back, which is why I'm looking at a Forester and not an Outback or Impreza, I don't want to sit like I'm in a car anymore. Another thing I'm hoping to see with the 2019 is the direct injection they brought to the new Impreza, increasing the horsepower as well as improving gas mileage.

As mostly everyone here is a Forester owner or prior Forester owner, what are your guys' thoughts? Is it worth the wait? Are the potential improvements significant enough?

My other issue is NA vs XT, I know the regular boxer engine is fairly reliable, but I'm concerned about the turbo meeting that same expectation. I want to buy this car with the intention of driving it until it dies or at least has hit 300k. I love the idea of the extra power for certain situations like getting up to speed on the highway, especially with a fully loaded vehicle, etc. but don't love the idea of my turbo kicking the bucket and being out thousands in repair costs.

Any input would be greatly appreciated, this would be my first Subaru, I've always loved them and with my bad back I have an excuse to try and get myself into one!

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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 12:29 PM
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I never buy in the first year of a new generation - usually in the 3rd or 4th year of a model generation I have a 17 XT Touring and just love the power and responsiveness. I know with any increase in complexity, comes increased risk and potential costs. If I have to replace the turbo at 150-200K and drop 3K it's worth it for me

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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 01:08 PM
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Great question on waiting for the 19 over the 18. The thing is are you sure the 2019 will be the redesign? Also, agree with JumpingJackFlash, I'd never buy a first year product even with an almost 100% Japanese built auto, like the Forester.

When it comes to turbo vs. NA. Wife and I thought the same thing with longevity of the engine and turbo. We don't mind the 2.5i and we actually think it is quite zippy. Others on this site have a different opinion and would not be seen in a 2.5i. I will say this, if the XT came in a manual. It would be in my driveway. CVT fits the 2.5i just fine.
But, from what I hear the turbo engine in the Forester is extremely durable. Will the turbo go 300,000 miles without being replaced? I doubt it. I'm sure someone on the site will have more info on longevity. Turbo is faster. But, will cost more upfront, premium fuel cost, longevity of the turbo, and lower mpg no matter what people say. Just be careful on "alternative facts", if you think someone is being creative. They probably are being creative.

Good luck with your decision, and you can't go wrong with the current model year.

Last edited by ALS; 07-30-2017 at 01:10 PM. Reason: update
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 02:20 PM Thread Starter
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I appreciate the responses JumpingJackFlash and ALS.

So one option that was more or less hinted at when I was at the dealer was a three year lease with the option to break it at two if I were to upgrade. This would put me in line to get a 2020 Forester, second year of the new generation. Unfortunately I can't wait for the third or fourth, due to my back. Only thing is I owe 9k on my current vehicle, and have no idea how trading toward a lease works. They would indeed have to put the two year part in writing for me, and make the trade worth it. It's either that or aggressively pay off my car and go in for a 2018 or 2019. Issue with going current gen as I'm almost positive they'll include some features I want to see in the new gen, but then getting the first year (assuming 2019) it could have it's kinks to be worked out.

I'm conflicted here, to be sure.
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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohsnapseabass View Post
Only thing is I owe 9k on my current vehicle
Sounds like a good reason to not get anything right now, do you dislike your current car that you want to get out of it ASAP?

At the moment I think it's best to pay off your current car and wait and see what 2019 brings.

Subaru has a good track record with turbo engines, so I don't expect any unusual problems with the turbo.
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 02:31 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jzmtl View Post
Sounds like a good reason to not get anything right now, do you dislike your current car that you want to get out of it ASAP?

At the moment I think it's best to pay off your current car and wait and see what 2019 brings.

Subaru has a good track record with turbo engines, so I don't expect any unusual problems with the turbo.
Not the car that I dislike, it's sitting in one. I wanted to drive this car for much longer but that was until I found out how bad my back has gotten messed up. Dealing with scoliosis, sacralization, and at least one messed up disc. I'm 6'6" so getting in and out of cars is already not fun, no compound that with those back issues and you have my situation.
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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohsnapseabass View Post
I appreciate the responses JumpingJackFlash and ALS.

So one option that was more or less hinted at when I was at the dealer was a three year lease with the option to break it at two if I were to upgrade. This would put me in line to get a 2020 Forester, second year of the new generation. Unfortunately I can't wait for the third or fourth, due to my back. Only thing is I owe 9k on my current vehicle, and have no idea how trading toward a lease works. They would indeed have to put the two year part in writing for me, and make the trade worth it. It's either that or aggressively pay off my car and go in for a 2018 or 2019. Issue with going current gen as I'm almost positive they'll include some features I want to see in the new gen, but then getting the first year (assuming 2019) it could have it's kinks to be worked out.

I'm conflicted here, to be sure.

Itll likely be very expensive. Pay off your first car first, don't go underwater. Its not worth it on a car...


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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 03:22 PM
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I just want two add what @ALS stated. The turbo engine is very reliable and durable. Folks that don't know much about cars (painting a broad brush here and not addressing to anyone specifically on this forum) automatically knock a "turbo" engine as being unreliable or too "complex" and are afraid of something they do not understand. In the "older" days, I would agree that buying a turbo may be somewhat of a "risk" in terms of longevity expectations. However, the modern turbos of today are extremely reliable and the maintenance is about the same as a NA engine. The Subs 2.0XT is extremely reliable and should not be feared by those in the market for a fun vehicle. The XT is, not only fun, but the added cost to run one is very insignificant. The premium "required" (and you can run 87, 89 or 91-93) is only about an extra $350/year based on 15K miles per year at 93 octane. That's eating out for lunch for one month or a Starbucks for 60 days. I cannot imagine anyone on this forum not being able to afford an extra $300-$400/year on gas. My car insurance was inconsequential when asking my agent the delta between the NA and the XT as the Subs is already one of the safest vehicles on the road. Maintenance is no different really. Therefore, what it really boils down to is can you afford the cost of the turbo version? Also, do not forget that the CVT paired with the XT is a far better ride than when paired with the NA. In the end, don't talk yourself out of a XT or let someone else talk you out of one without first fully understanding the facts and the real delta in the cost of ownership which is minimal based on a reasonable income.
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by ohsnapseabass View Post
Not the car that I dislike, it's sitting in one. I wanted to drive this car for much longer but that was until I found out how bad my back has gotten messed up. Dealing with scoliosis, sacralization, and at least one messed up disc. I'm 6'6" so getting in and out of cars is already not fun, no compound that with those back issues and you have my situation.
I'm 6'3" and the Forester is great getting into and out of, but if you have back problems while actually sitting in the vehicle, I would advise you to try and do an extended test before you purchase - if that's even possible. The Forester front seats aren't the most supportive and the seat-bottoms are kind of short.

Since the Forester is my wife's car, I usually ride in the non-powered front passenger seat, which isn't that comfortable for me after a couple of hours. Not to mention that my head is fairly close to the moon roof in that spot.

Not related, but be careful when the rear hatch is open. I've smacked my head more that once!

Mike
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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 03:45 PM
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Right on Securityguy.

The turbo Foz has a better reliability history, and the current version has a stronger CVT.
Real world mpg is about 2 less than the NA.

If you have any concerns at all about the NA performance, if you are not totally satisfied with it, the addition of DI will not fix it for you.

You may want to consider another route. Buy a lease returned 2015 or 2016 XT. The largest depreciation is done, and you can wait for the 2020 or later Foz.

Android Auto or Apple Carplay are great, but if you time your new car purchase for that, it will be the most expensive sound system you could have. You can get that easily on the aftermarket.


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Last edited by bashfulbernie; 07-30-2017 at 03:54 PM.
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post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 05:50 PM
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do you owe 9k on your current vehicle or are you 9k under water in your current vehicle? Owing 9k on a vehicle that's worth > 9k isn't a problem...rolling money under-water into a lease just seems like a bad idea.
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post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 06:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohsnapseabass View Post
Not the car that I dislike, it's sitting in one. I wanted to drive this car for much longer but that was until I found out how bad my back has gotten messed up. Dealing with scoliosis, sacralization, and at least one messed up disc. I'm 6'6" so getting in and out of cars is already not fun, no compound that with those back issues and you have my situation.
What Subatron said about the seats is what I want to say as well. Forester's seat isn't the most comfortable on the market, especially at your height, you may find there isn't enough thigh support. Maybe it's best to rent one and go on an extended trip to see how it works for you, you don't want to spend all that money to swap cars only back to square one.

At the same time take a look at Outback, which has better seats IMO.
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post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by securityguy View Post
I just want two add what @ALS stated. The turbo engine is very reliable and durable. Folks that don't know much about cars (painting a broad brush here and not addressing to anyone specifically on this forum) automatically knock a "turbo" engine as being unreliable or too "complex" and are afraid of something they do not understand. In the "older" days, I would agree that buying a turbo may be somewhat of a "risk" in terms of longevity expectations. However, the modern turbos of today are extremely reliable and the maintenance is about the same as a NA engine. The Subs 2.0XT is extremely reliable and should not be feared by those in the market for a fun vehicle. The XT is, not only fun, but the added cost to run one is very insignificant. The premium "required" (and you can run 87, 89 or 91-93) is only about an extra $350/year based on 15K miles per year at 93 octane. That's eating out for lunch for one month or a Starbucks for 60 days. I cannot imagine anyone on this forum not being able to afford an extra $300-$400/year on gas. My car insurance was inconsequential when asking my agent the delta between the NA and the XT as the Subs is already one of the safest vehicles on the road. Maintenance is no different really. Therefore, what it really boils down to is can you afford the cost of the turbo version? Also, do not forget that the CVT paired with the XT is a far better ride than when paired with the NA. In the end, don't talk yourself out of a XT or let someone else talk you out of one without first fully understanding the facts and the real delta in the cost of ownership which is minimal based on a reasonable income.
Great points on overall cost for premium fuel. Guess it's more of a mental thing pulling up at the pump. "Damn I have to buy the expensive stuff".

I currently do and have worked in the past with owners of the XT. None of them averaged over 24 mpg. All depends on if you step into it or not.

How long do the current turbos last ? 175,000, 200,000 miles? Would like to follow this for possible future XT purchase.
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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-30-2017, 06:41 PM
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I've got to agree with the others. I don't buy a 1st year, except when I did in '09. I was eager for a vehicle that could handle New England weather.

The gas thing... I just don't care. If you do the actual math, and 5-7mpg difference is enough to break the bank? You shouldn't be buying these vehicles at all and go for a less expensive model. The XT is a blast though.

I know nothing.
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