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2012 Lexus RX 350 8 speed auto
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Drove my daughter-in-laws new Sport. I've a question about Lane Assist. It seemed as if I did a lot of steering and am wondering if the Lane Assist may cause oversteer. I tend to keep to the right on right hand curves and to the left on left hand curves. I believe the Lane Assist was fighting me. Anybody else noticed this? Next time I drive it I'll turn the lane assist off. Or, it might be the electric power steering is more sensitive than I am uses to.

All the rest of the driver assist functions were great! ACC and blind spot monitor are great. Fortunately, I don't know if the forward ememgency brakeing works!:smile2:
 

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I’m not sure I have the answer to your question; but I think that when you say “oversteer” you may mean something other than what “oversteer” is conventionally understood to mean in driving circles:

https://drivingfast.net/oversteer/

Unless of course, you are throwing the car around corners at breakneck speed (more likely to induce understeer in a subaru).
 

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2019 Forester Sport Auto
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143 Posts
I only use lane assist on highways when I'm using cruise control. Otherwise it does sometimes feel like a pinball bouncing back and forth to stay in the lane.

Sent from my SM-T713 using Tapatalk
 

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Drove my daughter-in-laws new Sport. I've a question about Lane Assist. It seemed as if I did a lot of steering and am wondering if the Lane Assist may cause oversteer. I tend to keep to the right on right hand curves and to the left on left hand curves. I believe the Lane Assist was fighting me. Anybody else noticed this? Next time I drive it I'll turn the lane assist off. Or, it might be the electric power steering is more sensitive than I am uses to.

All the rest of the driver assist functions were great! ACC and blind spot monitor are great. Fortunately, I don't know if the forward ememgency brakeing works!:smile2:
]
rnb
It's not called oversteer but anyway yes and yes... This is part of why I don't use lane assist. The best way through a corner isn't in the center of the lane.
 

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2012 Lexus RX 350 8 speed auto
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70 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I knew "oversteer" was the wrong term, but you got the idea. "the best way through a cornor isn't the center of the lane" I also have hearing loss and I am sure the buzzer was going off. Next time I drive it I'll turn the assist off and see if that was it. Did experment a little on x-way and you feel like a pinball as the assist takes you from line to line.

Thanks, you answered my question.
 

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2018 Forester Touring Automatic 4 Cyl.
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67 Posts
I find it useful at night with the cruise control on. If you should go into a trance [ lose attention ] it will remind you by nudging you.
 

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2018 2.0 FXT-Touring CVT
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I only use lane assist on highways when I'm using cruise control. Otherwise it does sometimes feel like a pinball bouncing back and forth to stay in the lane.

Sent from my SM-T713 using Tapatalk
I turned it off as soon as I figured out how. Never turned it back on. The feature, in my opinion, is slightly more useful than the start/stop feature on the ignition. By that I mean that they are complete and utter drivel and the people that came up with them need to be spanked, put on dunce hats and go stand in the corner until he end of days. Just my opinion though.
 

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2019 Touring CVT
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305 Posts
Lane keep assist only activates when the vehicle is out of the lane of travel, as indicated by the highway lines. If you are within your lane it will not do anything. The exception is extra lines or seams of asphalt repair that fool eyesight.
 

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2019 Forester
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I find its gentle nudge is good when I travel on highway. you didn't say what type of car you normally drive. I found it took a while to get used to my Sport's handling - it seemed a bit vague to me when I just got car = but I'm more used to it now.
 

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2012 Forester X Auto
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@Nasarog - Too funny!
Your opinion isn't alone in the woods.
There have been more than a few studies which report that "automated driver assistance" features are providing a proximate cause for the reduction in driver competence.
It isn't too hard to see why, because human nature typically looks for a way to be lazy.. or stated in the positive, to reduce effort.
If you can rely on the car, rather than on your own driving, you tend to do that.
So, not looking to stay in your lane - No problem - The car will nudge you.
Changing lanes without looking - The car warns/prevents that.
Don't look behind when backing up...
While these features can be seen as good, and certainly are in many circumstances, the problem is that they also function to reinforce bad driving habits.
These are even touted in ads highlighting the "safety features" - Teen driver texting rather than looking at the road avoids a fender bender.
That same teen who didn't have a minor accident, may later have a major one, and one that the safety system cannot prevent.
No lesson was learned that texting and driving was a bad idea.

The problem in general is that these features should not be relied upon, but are, and as noted in Murphy's law, things that can fail, will, and at the worst possible time.
 

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2018 2.0 FXT-Touring CVT
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@DragonSubie7 - I love the backup camera and warning indicators for oncoming traffic and the like, but I still turn my head and look. Every. Single. Time. One moment there's no one there, and another has a fool flying down the lane while you're trying to back up. Or maybe you are trying to park and someone steps out. But the lane assist is a disaster. I remember people losing their minds over the feature because they thought the car was hacked and out of control. The rear camera is one of the single most important features if you have young kids and pets.
 

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2012 Forester X Auto
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@Nasarog - You sound like a driver who developed safe driving habits and that's a good thing.
The problem is that for every one of you, there are many others who use the features as a crutch.
If you learned to drive in your car, it is more likely that you would tend to develop habits that include reliance on those driver assists, and research supports this.

I agree with you on the backup camera - Especially on a car with a hatch - It is impossible to see, for instance, a small child who rode his tricycle right behind your car while you got in. The warnings while you back up are great too, again because it can be sometimes difficult to see, and in the case you pointed out, you look, it's clear and someone is speeding around a corner just at the wrong time.

On the other hand, you have people who expect the car to avoid running off the road because they are too tired to drive safely and should not be behind the wheel.

Automated driving features have a long way to go, and may never be able to exceed the ability of a good defensive driver, of course there are not many of the latter on the road....
 

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2019 Touring CVT
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305 Posts
@DragonSubie7 There have been millions of automobile accidents and tens of thousands of deaths each year in the US before these multiple safety features started to appear on our vehicles. Dumb, inattentive driving started long before our “dependence” on automated assistance.
Good drivers still stay attentive and drive defensively.
 

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19 19 Touring, 17TrgXT CVT
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632 Posts
@DragonSubie7 has a well supported perspective:


https://www.ctvnews.ca/features/how...ctually-be-making-our-driving-worse-1.3823118

Depends on the user understanding the operation and limitations of safety systems and the vehicle in general - as well as always maintaining a high level of situational awareness. Same principles apply whether you are operating a moped or an F-35. There will always be different abilities among people to adapt to new technology. That's why most of the more intrusive safety features have "off" buttons. Users' choice. I prefer to have our current choices ( I keep mine "on.")
 

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2019 Forester Touring
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Even the best safety systems can be defeated by a dedicated idiot, given enough time...

That’s because it’s virtually impossible to design and implement a system that can anticipate every possible occurrence of any possible event.

I’m a big proponent in the idea of enhanced safety systems, but even so, my thoughts are this:

Well-designed Driver’s safety systems can prove extremely helpful to attentive drivers that may rarely need them, but drivers that constantly rely on them for safe driving are bound to be sorely disappointed by their functionality.... in other words, the better drivers will become safer drivers, and the worst drivers will get even worse.

We may indeed see the day of affordable and reliable completely autonomous driven automobiles everywhere, but I suspect it’s going to be some time before they show up in everyday driving. However, we may see them sooner in specific situations where the environment can be more controlled.
 

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@DragonSubie7 There have been millions of automobile accidents and tens of thousands of deaths each year in the US before these multiple safety features started to appear on our vehicles. Dumb, inattentive driving started long before our “dependence” on automated assistance.
Good drivers still stay attentive and drive defensively.
One cannot make a legitimate argument against the obvious facts you stated.

The problem added, that studies confirm, is that even a good driver can become dependent on safety features, and become less effective.
This becomes a greater problem for those who have ingrained bad habits that switch cars.
If you expect the car to tell you it's unsafe to change lanes (a bad idea anyway) and don't look, that rental car may not have the same feature.
If you read through this thread, comments have been made that it's great the car woke me up from my trance...
The OP even wanted the car to prevent him from running into the median when he was falling asleep at the wheel.
Drivers can become lulled into thinking that driving while impaired (lack of sleep) is fine...
Why not zone out when cruise control automatically slows you down and speeds you up.. Convenient, yes, but it provides the driver with a rationalized justification to "safely" reduce their situational awareness, and that is what the studies find, not surprisingly.

These things didn't happen until recently, and are part of the unintended consequence of automated "safety improvement".

I agree that @FelineFreddie made a good point - As a driver "enhancement" some features can make a good driver even safer, but the flip side is that it can make a poor driver worse.

There are other unintended consequences, like the folks who have their car slam on the brakes on the interstate because of a tumbleweed or a plastic bag, or for no reason at all because of a system failure. All of these incidents were reported on this website.

In my opinion, if your car is routinely using it's inattentive driver safety features to keep you from getting in an accident, at some point that isn't going to work out well. If you pretend the features don't exist, or turn them off when they shouldn't be used, or can't be used safely, they are likely a better asset.
 

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19 19 Touring, 17TrgXT CVT
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Try Google @Lockheed Suggest you input ADAS, Driver Assistance Safety Systems, Consumer Adaptation. Adaptation and consumer familiarity are a significant issue. For starters, there are issues with nomenclature, let alone system operation:

https://advocacy.consumerreports.or...ver-assistance-systems-standard-nomenclature/


You'll find well reasoned articles, data supported work by RAND Corporation, McKinsey, IIHS, etc. We are aligned - DND (Data, Not Drama) :thumbsup:
 

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2018 2.0 FXT-Touring CVT
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3,067 Posts
@Nasarog - You sound like a driver who developed safe driving habits and that's a good thing.
The problem is that for every one of you, there are many others who use the features as a crutch.
If you learned to drive in your car, it is more likely that you would tend to develop habits that include reliance on those driver assists, and research supports this.

I agree with you on the backup camera - Especially on a car with a hatch - It is impossible to see, for instance, a small child who rode his tricycle right behind your car while you got in. The warnings while you back up are great too, again because it can be sometimes difficult to see, and in the case you pointed out, you look, it's clear and someone is speeding around a corner just at the wrong time.

On the other hand, you have people who expect the car to avoid running off the road because they are too tired to drive safely and should not be behind the wheel.

Automated driving features have a long way to go, and may never be able to exceed the ability of a good defensive driver, of course there are not many of the latter on the road....
Yes, agreed. But you know what? If they tightened the driving rules in the US, I bet I wouldn't be unique.
 
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