Subaru Forester Owners Forum banner

241 - 260 of 303 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
51 Posts
I've been busy for awhile and lost track of the thread. Thanks for posting your details, I appreciate it and think others will too.

The stock 3.5" HK speakers ran pretty low. I would guess around 500Hz and 3000Hz for the coaxial tweeter. I do not know where the non-HK system is set for, but it too is a coaxial, so I would guess the frequency range is the same.

I would love to see some photos of your setup if you can post. Does the CV sub have an integrated amp? Any overheating problems? What did you do about the panel and cargo tray that sit above the cargo floor. I'm sure many people are curious how you resoved this.

Cheers,
No overheating, no issues at all honestly. I used a small drywall saw to adapt the foam.
523151
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
364 Posts
Discussion Starter #243
Nice mod on the rear speakers!

Can you share a photo, model and specs of the Infinity 3.5 inch speakers. There are very few speakers that have a very high sensitivity to sound good with the stock HU power and I think Infinity was one of the few brands that offered a couple options.

As a reminder, did you have the 4 speaker system or the 6 speaker premium system when you started?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
364 Posts
Discussion Starter #244
So, did you put the cargo tray mat right on top of the foam piece or are you using the floor board? I dont see the floor board in the picture. I am just wondering how the sound will come through that board and if you had to cut hole in it or somthing. It just seems that the air will not pass through that board.

It's pretty awesome to keep the spare tire as most wheel well subs mean you give up the spare.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
51 Posts
So, did you put the cargo tray mat right on top of the foam piece or are you using the floor board? I dont see the floor board in the picture. I am just wondering how the sound will come through that board and if you had to cut hole in it or somthing. It just seems that the air will not pass through that board.

It's pretty awesome to keep the spare tire as most wheel well subs mean you give up the spare.
I started with the larger display screen and 6 spkr setup.

Highly recommend NOT using the infinity 3.5" the highs are God awful at higher volume. I mean they actually hurt. I'm using the Infinity Reference 375TX 3/4" dome tweeters and they are spot on. Stock tweeters were not real bad just missing something in that mid-range area. These tweeters were the perfect balance imo. A lot of trial to find the best match.

No issues with the sub bass coming through the board no modifications or even when the trunk is jammed full. I needed my trunk to be able to handle full heavy loads. The bass is HARD hitting, more than enough for most.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
364 Posts
Discussion Starter #246 (Edited)
Hey folks, not sure if you are all aware, but there was a new software update released last week. You can follow the instructions on the bulletin to download the file from Subarunet.com. Appendix A details all the updates for this software version.

Be sure to download the correct file. There is one for Gen 3.1 Base (4 speaker), Mid (Premium 6 speaker) and High (HK 9 speaker).

I downloaded tonight and will upload and try it out in the morning.

Attaching bulletin.

There is a dedicated thread to this topic here: https://www.subaruforester.org/threads/2019-service-bulletin-harman-kardon-gen-3-1-upgrade-is-now-available.805299/#post-7572661

Post #13 has a link to the files for those having trouble logging into subarunet.
 

Attachments

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
364 Posts
Discussion Starter #247
I started with the larger display screen and 6 spkr setup.

Highly recommend NOT using the infinity 3.5" the highs are God awful at higher volume. I mean they actually hurt. I'm using the Infinity Reference 375TX 3/4" dome tweeters and they are spot on. Stock tweeters were not real bad just missing something in that mid-range area. These tweeters were the perfect balance imo. A lot of trial to find the best match.

No issues with the sub bass coming through the board no modifications or even when the trunk is jammed full. I needed my trunk to be able to handle full heavy loads. The bass is HARD hitting, more than enough for most.
I am really intrigued with that subwoofer. It is about time someone made somthing like that.

The Infinity tweter is running 93dB. I would guess this has equal volum compared to the stock speaker. Any chance you did a volume comparison before replacing both stock speakers.

Do you by chance have your own thread started somewhere with more details of your build?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
51 Posts
Stock volume before fosgate was pretty bad, just adding the amp and 6*9s was pretty dramatic, the dsp is very well tuned for the stock tweeters, which likely contributs to why all the 3.5's I tested were so bad at higher volumes. The infinity tweeters definitely add a little volume and some additional body to the sound.. but they are also just a smidge brighter on occasion, but that may also be sirus and the broadcast compression. I was considering testing the HK dash speakers but couldn't find any to play with. I also was contemplating trying a few more tweeters rated to go a bit lower in frequency. No sorry I didn't start a thread at this point, most material is well covered, you and others did a great job.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
364 Posts
Discussion Starter #249
Does the Fosgate amp provide power to the dash speakers too or just the door speakers?

I can loan you the HK 3.5 speaker. They are for sale too if you like them. If not you can just return them. I am curious how they would fare with the 6 speaker setup.

In general, I highly recommend running more than a tweeter in the dash. A true 3.5 in midrange driver should give you a frequency response from 315Hz to 20kHz. This will pull the vocals in front of you and widen / deepen the soundstage.

While your Infinity R tweeters may sound better than the stock speaker and the Infinity 3.5s I still think the right 3.5" driver will outperform the tweeters. The HK speakers may just do it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
51 Posts
Does the Fosgate amp provide power to the dash speakers too or just the door speakers?

I can loan you the HK 3.5 speaker. They are for sale too if you like them. If not you can just return them. I am curious how they would fare with the 6 speaker setup.

In general, I highly recommend running more than a tweeter in the dash. A true 3.5 in midrange driver should give you a frequency response from 315Hz to 20kHz. This will pull the vocals in front of you and widen / deepen the soundstage.

While your Infinity R tweeters may sound better than the stock speaker and the Infinity 3.5s I still think the right 3.5" driver will outperform the tweeters. The HK speakers may just do it.
All channels go through the amp, they all appear to be powered and tuned
Does the Fosgate amp provide power to the dash speakers too or just the door speakers?

I can loan you the HK 3.5 speaker. They are for sale too if you like them. If not you can just return them. I am curious how they would fare with the 6 speaker setup.

In general, I highly recommend running more than a tweeter in the dash. A true 3.5 in midrange driver should give you a frequency response from 315Hz to 20kHz. This will pull the vocals in front of you and widen / deepen the soundstage.

While your Infinity R tweeters may sound better than the stock speaker and the Infinity 3.5s I still think the right 3.5" driver will outperform the tweeters. The HK speakers may just do it.
All channels are powered the fronts are combined and I would definitely take you up on trying the HK fronts, I'd love to see how they fair as well. To be honest I didn't try a driver only just coax, that maybe with testing as well.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
51 Posts
** edit the alpines were exhausting to listen to over extended periods even with a 6db cut. I think it really comes down to how the system is tuned.. for giggles I put the stock tweeters back in and I'm in love again I think I'm going to leave these in. Lol full circle.

New recommendation for anyone doing separates or especially looking for something that will match up well to the Fosgate update.. the Alpine SPR-10TW,, I ended up wanting more control over level that I was not getting with the infinity tweeters. The Alpine carry a lower range 1000hz to 29khz and with the -4db cut in place it's really a phenomenal tweeter that is just awesome to listen too.. great staging. I was happy before but this is awesome now. Still playing with the best angle but getting close.

523400
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
364 Posts
Discussion Starter #252
Looking good. I think the HK speakers range may be a little lower than that of the Alpine and more sensitive. When you toss them in, be sure to do one at a time and report back on the volume comparison in addition to the quality.

I really wish there were specs available for the Fosgate amp. If it is pushing power to the dash speakers, I am really curious how much. Also curious if it is sending full range signal or has a high pass cut-off. If it is using a high pass cutoff, then selecting a speaker with a lower range won't matter. Arrgh, I really want to know those specs.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
364 Posts
Discussion Starter #253
I did find some specs. Nothing regarding crossover points. It looks like the amp is called Flex41 and is 300 watts. It claims to have 5 channels. 1 is a sub out channel. So that leaves 4 channels for the doors. My guess knowing RF is that it is 50x4 and 100x1. The dash speakers are integrated with the front door speakers. Likely running at 2 ohms so each of the front 4 speakers are seeing 50watts each.

Brian, can you share a photo of the stock dash speakers? Front and back? I wonder if these are tweeters or a midrange coaxial. Also curious if it has a crossover filter on it.

One way to test the range of the dash speaker is to connect your stock door speakers. If you can push that cone a decent amount then it is passing full range, which would be awesome. You can always use a passive inline crossover to get the range you need for the speaker. Knowing Fosgate, they would pass the signal full range if that stock tweeter has a filter on it.


Here is a video on the new Subaru OEM upgrade kit from Fosgate.

I also saw the specs in the background on that video. I truly am impressed!!! For $350 this is the absolutely the best bang for the buck for anyone with a 4 or 6 speaker system. Add in a nice set of 3.5" coaxials or tweeters and you can have a killer system for under $500.

Fosgate website has an PEM section and shares some details for this system. They do not have the Forester listed yet, but it is the same amp used in the Crosstek and others.

523403
523404
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
51 Posts
Looking good. I think the HK speakers range may be a little lower than that of the Alpine and more sensitive. When you toss them in, be sure to do one at a time and report back on the volume comparison in addition to the quality.

I really wish there were specs available for the Fosgate amp. If it is pushing power to the dash speakers, I am really curious how much. Also curious if it is sending full range signal or has a high pass cut-off. If it is using a high pass cutoff, then selecting a speaker with a lower range won't matter. Arrgh, I really want to know those specs.
Ok some thoughts to help...

It's a 5 channel 300watt rms setup so I suspect all are 40-50w x4. The rear doors must be pass thru and deck powered, which you can tell because at times the amp will mute (has to do with my phone) and only hear functions off the rear speakers. This would actually allow the 6x9 and tweeters to have an electronic crossover point. Typically Rockford has adjustable 50-250 hi pass low pass options, this would explain why you can get so loud with such a clear powerful output. The sub output is there but disabled, there is also a unused plug for a remote that I assume would enable and control the sub when in use. The dsp likely is tuned and timed with tweeters in the dash since this is the expected position. The stock 1" soft dome tweeters do have capacitors to block bass but again I suspect they are also on a highpass 250 12db e-crossover.

*The stock electrical run doesn't have the wire gauage or fuse to handle a sub IMO. If this was to be used I would run a 10guage min wire from the battery to power it. This will likely never have a stock upgrade to take advantage of the subwoofer output.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
51 Posts
Stock speakers in the 6 channel non-hk setup are 2 pairs of 6.75 coax and a set of tweeters, the 1" soft dome tweeters are surprising good. They do have a cap on them to block bass.

523405
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
364 Posts
Discussion Starter #257
Cool, thanks for sharing. Interesting that the Premium system has 1" tweeters and the HK uses a true midrange coaxial.

According to the diagram above, the amp power is for the 4 door speakers. The dash speakers in the diagram look smaller and forward. There is a schematic that suggests the power is shared with the front door speakers. This would make sense to preserve the balance/faser functions.

I am not sure about the audio pass through for phone conversation to the rear speakers. That does seem strange. It almost sounds like the wires were revered. Does your balance/fader work properly?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
51 Posts
Cool, thanks for sharing. Interesting that the Premium system has 1" tweeters and the HK uses a true midrange coaxial.

According to the diagram above, the amp power is for the 4 door speakers. The dash speakers in the diagram look smaller and forward. There is a schematic that suggests the power is shared with the front door speakers. This would make sense to preserve the balance/faser functions.

I am not sure about the audio pass through for phone conversation to the rear speakers. That does seem strange. It almost sounds like the wires were revered. Does your balance/fader work properly?
All works yes... Zero fade issues certainly less power in the rear, it's very evident when you are in the car. It makes sense that they are on pass through as those stock speakers could never handle that power and it wouldn't mess with Fading at all. I replaced the rears with some Rockford coax speakers but I have been eyeballing those Polk db 6.5 speakers as they are way more efficient... But I'm worried it may pull the sound stage backward... Soo maybe I just leave it alone and keep the cost down haha. :).

The Audio pass through is noticable when the phone stops communicating to the head unit when plugged in.. the rear speakers keep playing and the amped speakers are mute until I hit radio or change source. Seems to happen more often since the update :(. It was just where I noticed they don't align and what lead me to that conclusion.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6 Posts
No worries at all. There is nothing wrong with the HK system at all. I was super impressed with it. If you are not willing to bypass the HK and run new amps with a DSP then it is likely not worth a change. I'm not sure it is even worth a speaker swap, because the HK speakers are very sensitive and it will be hard to find other high quality speakers with a high sensitivity that can match. I just wish the HK speakers did not use paper cones. I get lots of snow and worried about the moisture in the doors.
I ended up putting the HK mid woofers back in the front doors and some infinities in the dash. I'm pleased with the sound. I think the system remains balanced, but I do have to have the mid and high equalizer settings up near high to get my desired sound. I had to do pretty close to that with the factory dash speakers as I recall as well.
 
241 - 260 of 303 Posts
Top