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Ah crap.. I'm back with my 05 XS
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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
OK folks, at 66k miles, I am another HG failure victim :mob:
I have a 2005 XS (non-turbo)

Anyhow, can you all help me make a list of parts I need, parts to replace while I'm there, and procedures that needs to be done?

So far, parts I need:
2 Cometic MLS Headgaskets (COM C4264-040, or should I go for a different thickness?)
2 Intake Manifold gaskets (Grimmspeed perhaps?)
2 Exhaust Flange Gaskets (Grimmspeed perhaps?)
2 Valve Cover Gaskets
4 Spark Plug Tube Seals
10 Valve Cover Bolt Seals
6 Exhaust flange nuts (for the header to the block)
ARP Head studs (260-4702) $$$$!!

Because I have an extra t-stat housing leak (no weep at the water pump weep hole):
1 Thermostat
1 Thermostat gasket
1 Thermostat housing
2 gallons of coolant

Subaru tech says F the conditioner--I wonder if the condition has been causing pressure build up and radiator end tanks to blow?

During the procedure, I need to watch out for:
Cracked heads
What else do we need to do?
Swap to 257? LOL jk

Thanks all!
 

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2014 CVT
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824 Posts
its not so much cracks, as much as warped heads, and the block which you need a machined straight edge to check
 

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Ah crap.. I'm back with my 05 XS
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Discussion Starter #4
Also, I guess I really should just change the timing belt, water pump, idlers, etc.
 

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2008 Forester X Premium 5MT
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I would do a .030" thick HG but that is me. IIRC the stock HG is ~.024"
 

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1998 Forester S
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78 Posts
What would be the advantage to increasing the head gasket thickness and where or how would one go about finding a thicker gasket? When I did my HG job I ordered my gaskets from subaru, and I just ordered the only one they showed.
 

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Ah crap.. I'm back with my 05 XS
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Discussion Starter #8
Compression I suppose.. Cometic sells it as 0.40 but I can ask for 0.30. I just don't have much time. I need all these parts by the 15th.
 

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2008 Forester X Premium 5MT
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What would be the advantage to increasing the head gasket thickness and where or how would one go about finding a thicker gasket? When I did my HG job I ordered my gaskets from subaru, and I just ordered the only one they showed.
Compression I suppose.. Cometic sells it as 0.40 but I can ask for 0.30. I just don't have much time. I need all these parts by the 15th.
There really is none, Cometic specs the same HG for the Turbo(.040") and the NA(~.024 IIRC). There is no harm(mechanical) in using the .040 HG in NA applications and some say the OEM STI HG is the answer to the NAs HG issues as is. The only draw back is it slightly drops your compression ratio. Any loss in performance, none that you would see on a dyno and you wont feel it in the butt dyno either.

Cometic is quick, 3 day turn around on most items I have special ordered into the shop in the past.

As for a general list for the HG:

Subaru Valve Ccover gasket set
with 10 rubber grommets and-----------------runs $72 at subarupartsforyou.com
4spark plug tube seals
(local dealer items for me)

Intake gaskets -------------------------------$5ea, $10pair at subarupartsforyou.com
(local dealer items for me)

Exhaust gaskets-------------------------------$9ea, $18pair at subarupartsforyou.com
(local dealer items for me)

While in there I tell people to do these items also, but at 66K I would pass on some of them.

-Reseal oil pump/O-ring & retorque/loctite the rotor cap screws
-Water pump & gskt(pass?)
-idler pulleys(pass?)
-T-belt(would do)
-T-stat & gskt (oem)
-Plugs(would do)
-Radiator hoses(pass)
-oil & filter
Think that's it

The overhaul gasket set comes with every thing you need, plus valve seals, several extra O-rings for various items, wrist pin clips. If looking at the overhaul kit I usually order Kit # 10105AA930. It is meant for the final assembly of the reman short block, basically what you strip yours down to to do HG. It also comes with valve seals.

You can see what the various kit contain by looking here Subaru parts catalog
 

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2008 Forester X Premium 5MT
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Ah if you are paranoid about future failures go with a set of OEM head bolts, the ARPs would be a wast of $$ in my opinion.

When putting down the HGs, DRY DRY DRY. DRY block, DRY heads, DRY gaskets and no adhesion promoter like copper coat and the like. The viton rubber that the gaskets are coated in needs to melt/form a bond to the surfaces of the block and heads. It can't do this if there is liquid in between.

Also double check the orientation of the HG, they can be installed backwards(flipped front to back).
 

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2014 Impreza Ltd CVT
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3,319 Posts
Here's a link to the current Subaru headgasket. As far as putting it in backwards, look toward the left top, you will see the extra hole ( as compared to the left bottom ), where the oil pressure enters the head from the block. If installed backward, this will stick up on the opposite side of the head. The top of the heads are NOT symmetrical front to rear.

http://www.subaruforester.org/vbull...5675-2006-head-gaskets-problem-11044aa633.jpg

On my recent rebuild, I replaced just what was suggested above...... and I have yet to replace the head bolts on any Subaru rebuild I have done.

Also must wholly agree .... dry dry dry clean surfaces, and if you can, get the plane of the heads checked for flatness.

Also remember, look at the 2 CENTER bolts when you remove them. They will have a different color paint on them then the 4 removed from each corner. They go back in the CENTER positions on each side.
 

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Ah crap.. I'm back with my 05 XS
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Discussion Starter #12
I thought the cost for OEM head studs is almost the same as ARP ones?

I think I'm going to get a full engine gasket set from here: OE Seals and Gaskets Kits - Subaru Impreza GC8 & RS Forum & Community: RS25.com

but skip on the HGs, exhaust, and intake gaskets from there and stick with Cometic and grimmspeed.

need a new tensioner too. i believe that's the source of some knocking sounds. and some of the pulleys are squealing.

ahhh and here i thought i was going to save some money this month.
 

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Ah crap.. I'm back with my 05 XS
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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)

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2008 Forester X Premium 5MT
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Yup, they all fail, at some point. The Cometic you can order in the right thickness, the STI you get .040"(IIRC).

I would PM one of our vendors to get the part number for the head bolts.
 

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2014 Forester CVT
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2004 Forester X HG in Canada

I started to see a seaping on left side and had both heads repaired/machined.

As for the gaskets, My tech is a subaru guy and he said he got the metal gaskets, which are better than the kit.

part number on my invoice is 11044aa642
Hope that helps, I think he said it was the same style as the STI gaskets. but don't quote me on that.

Good luck, I envy you doing the job yourself, if I had the place and time, it would be a fun job.

Cheers



OK folks, at 66k miles, I am another HG failure victim :mob:
I have a 2005 XS (non-turbo)

Anyhow, can you all help me make a list of parts I need, parts to replace while I'm there, and procedures that needs to be done?

So far, parts I need:
2 Cometic MLS Headgaskets (COM C4264-040, or should I go for a different thickness?)
2 Intake Manifold gaskets (Grimmspeed perhaps?)
2 Exhaust Flange Gaskets (Grimmspeed perhaps?)
2 Valve Cover Gaskets
4 Spark Plug Tube Seals
10 Valve Cover Bolt Seals
6 Exhaust flange nuts (for the header to the block)
ARP Head studs (260-4702) $$$$!!

Because I have an extra t-stat housing leak (no weep at the water pump weep hole):
1 Thermostat
1 Thermostat gasket
1 Thermostat housing
2 gallons of coolant

Subaru tech says F the conditioner--I wonder if the condition has been causing pressure build up and radiator end tanks to blow?

During the procedure, I need to watch out for:
Cracked heads
What else do we need to do?
Swap to 257? LOL jk

Thanks all!
 

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Ah crap.. I'm back with my 05 XS
Joined
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8,294 Posts
Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
I started to see a seaping on left side and had both heads repaired/machined.

As for the gaskets, My tech is a subaru guy and he said he got the metal gaskets, which are better than the kit.

part number on my invoice is 11044aa642
Hope that helps, I think he said it was the same style as the STI gaskets. but don't quote me on that.

Good luck, I envy you doing the job yourself, if I had the place and time, it would be a fun job.

Cheers

Well, I'm not really going to do it all by myself since I have to borrow a shop lift and work in the daytime. A Subie tech is quitting the dealership and he's been working on my car for a while now so he's going to be doing most of the grunt work while I learn. And actually if I run thin on time (since I have to work during the daytime) he will probably end up just finishing it without me lol.

That PN is for an XT/STI HG, namely the pre-07 XT/STIs, so that confirms what RS25 folks have been doing. Thanks!

The problem I face now is that I told him about this STI HG method and he doesn't believe it. I think he might be too closed to the idea of our Subarus being legos, even drivetrain wise (as are most dealership techs). He said if it has issues afterwards, it's on me, which I guess is understandable but slightly disappointing. He also doesn't think the heads need to be machined if this is my first time changing HGs... which frankly tells me that some shortcuts might be taken... like I want to get the right RA on the mating surfaces but I don't know if he will even check. But he says all the HG jobs he has done have never come back (but who does when they leak again?).

I might just drop the deal (and it's a good one) and go with a known shop to do it all quickly and according to my standards. I'm an A-type anyway.
 

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2008 Forester X Premium 5MT
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...part number on my invoice is 11044aa642
Hope that helps, I think he said it was the same style as the STI gaskets. but don't quote me on that....
#11044aa642 is for 2004-2006 turbo models.
Subarugenuineparts.com price $31.44ea

#11044aa770 is the current '06+ turbo/STI gasket.
Subarugenuineparts.com price $36.56ea

#11044aa633 is the NA HG
Subarugenuineparts.com price $29.98ea

Also here is some thing to think about, or at least I have been. Many Subaru owners like the Six Star brand oil filters as an option to replace the discontinued black ones.
http://www.subaruforester.org/vbulletin/f120/six-star-oil-filters-got-interest-49052/

How about a their MLS head gaskets?
neip_content
I have wanted to order a set just to see if there is any major differences or similarities. Yet one more HG that claims to be "the SOLUTION"

My true feeling on checking the heads to see if they are warped is that "most" shops/techs are not going to have a straight edge straight enough, .002" feeler gauge or the feel for such a thin feeler gauge to accurately check the head/block for flatness. I would rather most people skip checking them and eliminate a spot for error and just have them milled/ground. At which point I am also for doing a valve job and new valve seals.
 

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none none
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#11044aa642 is for 2004-2006 turbo models.
Subarugenuineparts.com price $31.44ea

#11044aa770 is the current '06+ turbo/STI gasket.
Subarugenuineparts.com price $36.56ea

#11044aa633 is the NA HG
Subarugenuineparts.com price $29.98ea

Also here is some thing to think about, or at least I have been. Many Subaru owners like the Six Star brand oil filters as an option to replace the discontinued black ones.
http://www.subaruforester.org/vbulletin/f120/six-star-oil-filters-got-interest-49052/

How about a their MLS head gaskets?
neip_content
I have wanted to order a set just to see if there is any major differences or similarities. Yet one more HG that claims to be "the SOLUTION"

My true feeling on checking the heads to see if they are warped is that "most" shops/techs are not going to have a straight edge straight enough, .002" feeler gauge or the feel for such a thin feeler gauge to accurately check the head/block for flatness. I would rather most people skip checking them and eliminate a spot for error and just have them milled/ground. At which point I am also for doing a valve job and new valve seals.
+1 I'd probably just send the heads out to be milled and then run the .4 cometic gaskets.
 

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2008 Forester X Premium 5MT
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Depends on the shop.

It varies around here from $50-200.

Some shops wont do it unless the head is disassembled. Others will do it while you wait with the valves and cams in the head.......

I use a local I went to high school with, I drop parts off in his enclosed motorcycle trailer on my way into work at 4am and leave him a phone message as to what I want done. On my way home I pick them up. Sweat deal.

For Subaru stuff(for me) he charges me $100 to mill/grind both heads and another $150to do the valve job(cut the seats and grind the valves(full radius)) but I also have every thing disassembled and do the reassembly my self.

Subaru stuff I do for other people I usually let him do all the work and just let the customer settle up the bill with him(essentially I am just a courier for these). I have seen him charge them between $350-550 depending on what needed to be done.

One reason I like to do the valve job is it allows a closer look at the valve guides to see if they are migrating. It is not some thing I would call common but I have seen a few Subarus drop the valve guide in the head which then causes the valve to hang open and burn, if your lucky. If you are really unlucky.... well these are interference engines:icon_frown:

Also look for cracks going from the valve seats to the spark plug hole. Some of these can cause problems in that the crack will open enough to take pressure off the valve seat and allow it to move. Don't be to alarmed if you see small cracks there however, the majority of the time these cracks pose no harm and will cause no issues and you can run the heads with out ever thinking about it again. If you see them I would at least want the valve pulled out to see if it is allowing the valve seat to move. This is also repairable but cost very.
 
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