[JETkoten]

Hi,

I went for a test drive today. Two cars: an '04 XT with 109K miles and an '05 Outback LL Bean with the 3.0R six cylinder engine and 99.5K miles. Here's the thing... I was very surprised to be completely underwhelmed with the turbo and completely blown away by the H6! :icon_biggrin:

I think that they have similar HP and torque ratings, right? The turbo XT seemed to be no more peppy than the 2.5i that I test drove a couple weeks ago. The 3.0R blew me away because it had a really great engine note and also so much torque on tap at a moment's notice with just the tiniest nudge of the pedal. :icon_arrow::icon_arrow::icon_arrow:

All the reviews and comments that I read from people who have the turbo have them all saying how furious it is, but this one I drove really wasn't at all to me. Any ideas why this might be?

J

 

[neoshi]

And then watch what happens when you get a better turbo (VF series on up) and a full turbo back (with a tune)

The NA 3.0R is good for torque all around (except at the top end). The turbo 2.5L is good for surging (think rocket ship). Depends on your driving style really. You'll see in AutoX, a lot of guys prefer NA engines.

 

[JETkoten]

Hmmm. Would you say that the 3.0R and the turbo are almost opposite of each other maybe, in terms of where the torque is in the revs?

So, would you say that the 3.0R is torquey at the lower part of the revs and the turbo is torquey at the highest revs?

I couldn't get the revs above 3500 on the turbo (or the 3.0R) 'cause of the nervous sales guy (see my other thread on this forum right now)... he kept acting like I was driving dangerously when I wasn't, at all.

If so, that might explain a lot! Thanks for your reply.

 

[funkymonkey1002]

There are a lot of things that can degrade the performance on the XT over time as well. With a dirty air filter mine hesitates and feels slower than my friend's NA in the low end.

In the XT if you floor it, it should throw you back in your seat almost uncomfortable, and probably make the nervous sales guy wet himself. The XT should feel quite a bit quicker, but the 3.0 will feel very strong down low. The new 3.6R just blows a stock XT away though.

 

[JETkoten]

There are a lot of things that can degrade the performance on the XT over time as well. With a dirty air filter mine hesitates and feels slower than my friend's NA in the low end.

In the XT if you floor it, it should throw you back in your seat almost uncomfortable, and probably make the nervous sales guy wet himself. The XT should feel quite a bit quicker, but the 3.0 will feel very strong down low. The new 3.6R just blows a stock XT away though.

Is the air filter easily accessible? I wonder if I could open the hood and take a look?

Also, where in the revs should the bulk of the throw-you-back-in-your-seat-ness happen with the XT? I couldn't watch the tachometer the whole time because I was driving unfamiliar streets in traffic, but I don't think I got much above 4000 RPMs, if that.

 

[MudRunner]

H6. Mmmm.... I'd go with that in a heartbeat. lol The engine note is just sex.

If I were going to keep it stock, anyway. XT has much more MOD potential.

EDIT: You'd feel the turbo 'punch' from 3000-5000 mostly, I think. It's a little turbo, so it spools fast and then runs out of steam up high. Lots of fun though. Air filter box is on the left side of the engine bay if you are facing it with the hood open. It's easily accessible, but sort of a pain to get the filter out and back in (with the lid seated properly).

 

[JETkoten]

H6. Mmmm.... I'd go with that in a heartbeat. lol

If I were going to keep it stock, anyway. XT has much more MOD potential.

The mods for the 3.0R do seem to be *very* few and far between.

I did see a YouTube video today where they had a 3.0R challenge a turbo (Legacys) and they turbo won both times they tested them.

For everyday driving on city streets the H6 did seem 110% meaner than the XT. Maybe the XT really shines at wide open throttle? That 3.0R though, it just seems like it's absolutely seething with power. I just slightly let my foot fall with gravity and it would smoothly zoom... :icon_cool:

 

[toddlamp]

Now go drive the 3.6R

 

[The Black Box]

Hi,All the reviews and comments that I read from people who have the turbo have them all saying how furious it is, but this one I drove really wasn't at all to me. Any ideas why this might be?J

I couldn't get the revs above 3500 on the turbo (or the 3.0R) 'cause of the nervous sales guy

You do realize how contradictory these statements are? I gave ride's in my bone stock XT to friends that drive Ferraris and Porsches and they all grabbed the "oh ****" handle. Try again...

 

[JETkoten]

H6. Mmmm.... I'd go with that in a heartbeat. lol The engine note is just sex.

If I were going to keep it stock, anyway. XT has much more MOD potential.

EDIT: You'd feel the turbo 'punch' from 3000-5000 mostly, I think. It's a little turbo, so it spools fast and then runs out of steam up high. Lots of fun though. Air filter box is on the left side of the engine bay if you are facing it with the hood open. It's easily accessible, but sort of a pain to get the filter out and back in (with the lid seated properly).

So, I wonder what could happen to make it seem so gutless, it really seemed no more powerful (or fun) at all than the 2002 Forester S that I drove a few weeks ago.

I should have been in that 3000-5000 range at least a couple of times and didn't feel thrown back in the seat in the least. It looked cool to see the hood scoop when I was riding around, but that was about it. I guess this might mean I should find another XT to test drive maybe... or drive this XT again with the pedal to the floor at times.

The H6 engine note truly is something special, I had to stop myself from writing about it again in an earlier reply. It is like a smooth, subtle snarl... it's great.

I wonder how the earlier 3.0R from the pre-2005s compares to the 2005+ 3.0R... anyone have experience with both? I think I read somewhere that the 2005+ 3.0R has about 25 more HP?

 

[JETkoten]

Now go drive the 3.6R

Would love to, but it would be purely for kicks... not as a contender for my next car. This 3.0R is at the very extreme top of my possible price range, and the 3.6R is far above the clouds, for now.

I'm sure it is incredible though!

 

[JETkoten]

You do realize how contradictory these statements are? I gave ride's in my bone stock XT to friends that drive Ferraris and Porsches and they all grabbed the "oh ****" handle. Try again...

Thanks for your reply. I hope you don't feel that I was slagging the XT... no way. I'm just trying to experience the legendary XT thrills and came up very short on my test drive. So, you're saying to take it for another spin and really go for it on the revs this time, and then I'll feel the thrills?

Could the turbo in this one be burned out or something? I noticed that they have two check boxes on the cars they sell, one for "As-is" and one for a 3 month warranty and this one was as-is... the 3.0R was 3 month.

 

[The Black Box]

It doesn't matter to me what anyone says about my cars because I know what they're capable of and I never need anyone's validation. I've raced motorcycles and tracked cars all my life so I definitely know what fast is.

With the XT's stock gearing when you floor it from idle in first gear it should pull like mad. If it doesn't there's something mechanically wrong with that car.

 

[JETkoten]

It doesn't matter to me what anyone says about my cars because I know what they're capable of and I never need anyone's validation. I've raced motorcycles and tracked cars all my life so I definitely know what fast is.

With the XT's stock gearing when you floor it from idle in first gear it should pull like mad. If it doesn't there's something mechanically wrong with that car.

Fair enough. Thanks for the input, that's the kind of thing this board is great for, because I have no experience with fast cars at all. I'll try it again.

 

[pleiad7]

I would have to wonder if the FXT you drove was running on regular gas instead of premium. That's a surefire way to cheat yourself out of the performance the car has to offer. What you describe sounds in no way normal even for a bone stock FXT. The 4.44 gearing alone makes for a rocketship experience. The stock turbo makes a lot of torque down low... Enough to push you back in your seat.

 

[Blue Fox]

Hi,
The turbo XT seemed to be no more peppy than the 2.5i that I test drove a couple weeks ago.

The XT is a very furious car, the one you test drove obviously has some sort of issues with it as there is NO WAY on Gods green earth you can EVER say that the XT feels "no more peppy than the 2.5i"...........reading that almost made me vomit up my supper :biggrin:

Something is VERY wrong with that XT then. You should be pinned in your seat when it hits 3000+ RPM, followed by a "HOLY CRAP" moment. I drove an older 3.0 High Output Outback (my friend's) and it had some power, but didn't feel anywhere near as quick or peppy as my XT. To give you perspective, I can floor it and across a four-lane intersection, I would already be doing 40mph one I cross it.

Like I said, something is wrong with that XT. DO NOT buy it and find yourself another one that works properly, you'll be glad you did.

 

[JETkoten]

I would have to wonder if the FXT you drove was running on regular gas instead of premium. That's a surefire way to cheat yourself out of the performance the car has to offer. What you describe sounds in no way normal even for a bone stock FXT. The 4.44 gearing alone makes for a rocketship experience. The stock turbo makes a lot of torque down low... Enough to push you back in your seat.

There could have been regular in it from the previous owner. It was empty on the lot, but the reserve light wasn't on yet, so it wasn't bone dry and there would have been some of the previous gas still in the tank.

The sales guy did know it needed premium because he filled it up with premium before the test drive, while I was there, and then talked about it during the test drive.

I definitely need to drive another turbo Subaru to compare this one to then. Thanks very much for your feedback.

 

[The Black Box]

Actually you don't even need to floor it as 1/2 of the pedal travel is equal to a wide open throttle plate. When I test drove the XT albeit new and tight I only goosed it and shifted at 4K or so and was sold. This was after test driving Audi S4 Avants, WRXwagons, and BWW 540i wagons.

 

[JETkoten]

The XT is a very furious car, the one you test drove obviously has some sort of issues with it as there is NO WAY on Gods green earth you can EVER say that the XT feels "no more peppy than the 2.5i"...........reading that almost made me vomit up my supper :biggrin:

Something is VERY wrong with that XT then. You should be pinned in your seat when it hits 3000+ RPM, followed by a "HOLY CRAP" moment. I drove an older 3.0 High Output Outback (my friend's) and it had some power, but didn't feel anywhere near as quick or peppy as my XT. To give you perspective, I can floor it and across a four-lane intersection, I would already be doing 40mph one I cross it.

Like I said, something is wrong with that XT. DO NOT buy it and find yourself another one that works properly, you'll be glad you did.

That's the kind of thing I was hoping for! So, I was really surprised when it was so lackluster. These early and more affordable manual FXTs it seems are hard to come by though, let alone at a reasonable price... and this one already had the 105K big service done, but, yeah, it sounds like this one is a dud... and though it may be the gas or the air filter or some other relatively minor thing, it'd likely be better to find one that just works.

Thanks for your perspective. By the way, the lights on your XT look great, and very functional! I drive back roads at night and have thought lately about decking my new car out with lots of lights to see better in the dark! Right now I just use a trick that I've found that if I push my high beam stick right in the middle and balance it there I can get high and low beams at the same time... :icon_cool:

 

[JETkoten]

Actually you don't even need to floor it as 1/2 of the pedal travel is equal to a wide open throttle plate. When I test drove the XT albeit new and tight I only goosed it and shifted at 4K or so and was sold. This was after test driving Audi S4 Avants, WRXwagons, and BWW 540i wagons.

That is the classic Subaru reputation that I'm looking to experience, in a nutshell. Performance that is as good, or much better, at 1/2 or 1/3 or even 1/4 of the price! Plus the added bonus of increased reliability and build quality, and so on...