Subaru Forester Owners Forum banner

1 - 20 of 36 Posts

·
Registered
2016 Ford RS & 2019 Subaru Descent
Joined
·
1,349 Posts
I'd like to see these tests done with a representative of each manufacturer operating their respective vehicles. Why is it when the Foz begins to slip, the driver keeps gassing it, whereas the driver lets off/gives up in the rest?
 

·
Premium Member
2014 Forester XT Touring CVT
Joined
·
12,780 Posts
Why is it when the Foz begins to slip, the driver keeps gassing it, whereas the driver lets off/gives up in the rest?
With the exception of the CRV, each test we on the gas the whole time until they were sliding backwards.

The Forester never slid backwards.
 

·
Registered
2011 Forester X Premium AT
Joined
·
812 Posts
I wonder if they did this with the SH...
 

·
Premium Member
2014 2.0 XT yes
Joined
·
2,752 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
You can really see the traction control working hard in this test. Each wheel is experiencing a lot of rapid intervention to maintain traction. It's a cool video just for that.

The only question I have is if the "don't get stuck button" (disable engine cutoff) was pressed on all the cars. On the Subaru, it's the VDC-disable (or X-mode if you have it). I assume the other vehicles have an equivalent as well. On my wife's is250, it's simply called "Snow" (it doesn't work).
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
144 Posts
All this demonstrated is that some tires have better wet coefficient of friction than other. Don't know what tires did Subaru used for this test, but I know that OEM Toyota and Mazda tires are particularly bad on wet surface.

On my wife's is250, it's simply called "Snow" (it doesn't work).
The "SNOW" button does not disable traction control. It modifies throttle response and transmission shift points for better control on slippery surface. To disconnect the traction control you use the "TRAC" button. "TRAC" can also be used to disable VSC.
 

·
Premium Member
2014 Forester XT Touring CVT
Joined
·
12,780 Posts
All this demonstrated is that some tires have better wet coefficient of friction than other. Don't know what tires did Subaru used for this test, but I know that OEM Toyota and Mazda tires are particularly bad on wet surface.
You can see the Forester is running on OEM Yokohoma Geolandars, which I understand are decent tires, but nothing great.
 

·
Registered
2018 XT Touring CVT
Joined
·
1,297 Posts
Subaru has the large advantage of always driving all 4 wheels.
There is no engagement time lag. That is probably the main factor in this test.
Everyone had traction control and tires that are good but not great.
 

·
Premium Member
2014 Forester XT Touring CVT
Joined
·
12,780 Posts
Subaru has the large advantage of always driving all 4 wheels.
There is no engagement time lag. That is probably the main factor in this test.
Everyone had traction control and tires that are good but not great.
I would argue that X-Mode is more valuable than anything else in this case.

It would be interesting to see an x-mode vs normal version of this for the Forester.
 

·
Registered
2010 Forester Active 2.0X MT 2x5 - MT with Dual Range reduction
Joined
·
1,236 Posts
Amazing!

It seems, the CVT tranmission together with the X-mode is a good replacement of the manual transmission combined with the Dual Range reduction.

But for a real comparison one should do the same test with a SH with engaged Dual Range and a) switched on, b) switched off VDC.
 

·
Premium Member
2014 Forester XT Touring CVT
Joined
·
12,780 Posts
Here are some videos showing X-Mode Enabled vs X-Mode Disabled.

You can see without X-Mode on, the wheels will spin.

X-Mode ON



X-Mode OFF



Closeup showing each wheel and the MFD during X-mode operation vs just having VDC on.

 

·
Registered
2014 Forester Ltd. CVT
Joined
·
1,779 Posts
I imagine the sg and sh would do smashingly if the driver threw the car in one of the low gears. X-mode is making up (and maybe improving on) the lack of 50-50 low gear on the SJ.
 

·
Premium Member
2014 2.0 XT yes
Joined
·
2,752 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
All this demonstrated is that some tires have better wet coefficient of friction than other. Don't know what tires did Subaru used for this test, but I know that OEM Toyota and Mazda tires are particularly bad on wet surface.
Tire grip is not the only factor. All the OEM tires in this test are average at best. How power is distributed (how much, when, and how smoothly) also part of the discussion. Which leads to why X-mode manipulates the throttle curve, and why there's a snow button on the is250...

The "SNOW" button does not disable traction control. It modifies throttle response and transmission shift points for better control on slippery surface. To disconnect the traction control you use the "TRAC" button. "TRAC" can also be used to disable VSC.
Note that I never mentioned disabling traction control in my post. That would be counterproductive in a low-traction situation.

I was specifically referring to the power-cut feature of VDC/ESC/VSC which is what gets you stuck in these situations, not traction control, which is associated with the brakes. You correctly point out that the button makes the throttle response sluggish (alarmingly so), which makes it easier to modulate the gas. It also helps to avoid the abrupt engine cutoff that happens when all wheels slip when ESC is enabled. I suspect the cutoff is disabled altogether, but I wasn't in the mood at the time to carefully test when we got stuck in the snow.

The shift point stuff doesn't apply for my wife's car: it's a stick.
 

·
Premium Member
2014 2.0 XT yes
Joined
·
2,752 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
One thing that's clear with Subaru's behaviour is that they have absolutely no problem shining the spotlight on their AWD system. And not just in the controlled "independent" videos like this one, which you always have to take with a grain of salt.

For each official video, there are dozens of owners doing ad hoc demos with their cars driving around in the mud, snowy hills, etc, showing what they can do. Trying to get Subarus stuck seems to be a common pastime in Russia, for example.

If the company was fibbing too much, the YouTube brigade would be all over it, plastering the airwaves with counter-examples.

The competition in the CUV space is much more quiet about demonstrating the capabilities of their AWD system. Most of what you see is them getting stuck in what we would consider pretty straightfoward situations.

At the MotoGP race at Laguna Seca this year, Land Rover had set up a bunch of steep dirt mounds do show what the Evoque could do. It reminded me of the ramp tests (or the dirt-mound tests Subaru does from time to time). No problem of course; LR takes their AWD seriously.

I would like to see them throw some higher-end equipment into these tests to see how they do against the Forester.
 
1 - 20 of 36 Posts
Top