Subaru Forester Owners Forum banner

1 - 20 of 25 Posts

·
Registered
98 Forester
Joined
·
54 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi

I'm in the process of removing my head gaskets, which is turing to be harder than planned. It's a 98 Subaru Forester S 2.5 DHOC, with 240,000 miles on the clock.

I have removed or moved the Radiator, Power Steering, Alternator, AC compressor & intake manifold. I have also removed the timing belt, and some of the pulley's associated with it.

But I have hit a problem, I can't seem to remove the Spark Plug Cables. Any ideas on how they are supposed to come out?

Thanks

James
 

·
Registered
2014 CVT
Joined
·
826 Posts
what do you mean cant remove them???? as in the cables wont come off the the plugs??? or they wont come off the coil???? also have you done this before, b/c your most likely better off pulling the motor, yes it can be done, but at the same time the heads should be checked to make sure they are level.
 

·
Registered
98 Forester
Joined
·
54 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
I got the spark plugs undone, they were just very stiff, it looks like it has been a while since they have been removed.

This is the first time I have done this but I don't have access to a hoist to get the engine out, and have a very small budget to work with.

I have a full gasket kit to replace everything I can and am going to replace the timing belt, others belts, water pump and some hoses at the same time.

Hopefully if I can get the heads off tonight I will be taking them to a machine shop tomorrow to get the checked out. But I keep on hitting problems.

The current one is unbolting the cam shafts. I am using a AJ to hold the cam still but it keeps on slipping off the shaft. I am using a 17 mm socket with a breaker bar and a 5ft (all I had) cheater bar on the end. So I can the torque to undo it but can't keep the cam shaft still.

Any ideas anyone, all help will be greatful
 

·
Registered
98 Forester
Joined
·
54 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
So i have managed to get the driver side cylinder head off and while I was doing it a bunch of the value heads (I think) fell off and I have no idea what order they go in, does this matter?
 

·
Premium Member
2008 2008 2.5i-2018 XT
Joined
·
13,267 Posts
Pictures. Not quite believing or understanding what I am reading. Hard to imagine doing this job without pulling the engine. I know it is possible but......
 

·
Premium Member
2008 Forester X Premium 5MT
Joined
·
8,073 Posts
This worries me :confused: , The DOHC is not only a valve to piston interference engine like the SOHC but it is also valve to vale.

I am worried with out pics of
valve heads
to confirm, that when the camshaft was being moved around a few valves may have been munched.
 

·
Registered
05 FXT 5MT
Joined
·
255 Posts
Oh boy.....

The DOHC is not the motor to try and change headgaskets on while in the car. As you found out, the cams have to come out in order to get the headbolts out. When you remove the exhaust cams, there's nothing but a little bit of oil to hold the shim buckets in place, so they are likely to fall out. It matters very much that they go back into the same position from which they came, as each shim is fitted to the exact length of the valve stem and gives the proper clearances. If dropped onto hard concrete, there is a very good chance of nicking them, which will undoubtedly cause them to stick in the bores.

What you'll want to do now, is have the machine shop set the clearances while the heads are there. They'll need to reinstall the cams and measure the clearances and find the correct thickness shim for that valve. Hopefully it's just 4 that fell out.....less hassle for choosing the correct shim.

It is very important to ensure the block deck is flat and clean, as well as the head surface. I believe it is way too much work to get this step done properly while the block is in the car. It would be best to yank the motor out and get all this stuff done where you have the room to pay attention and work. The extra 30min of work is well worth the headache. Wait until you need to torque things back together while it's in the car.......absolutely no fun at all.

Best of luck, but really consider pulling the motor out to complete this. A hoist shouldn't be that much to rent. There may even be a local scoob enthusiast who's got one you can borrow free. WI is a bit far for me to bring mine over..... :(

Jay Storm
 

·
Premium Member
2008 Forester X Premium 5MT
Joined
·
8,073 Posts
I do believe storm is right, completely slipped my mind about the buckets("valve heads" must be buckets).

Jstorm has some solid advice in his post.
 

·
Registered
98 Forester
Joined
·
54 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Oh boy.....

The DOHC is not the motor to try and change headgaskets on while in the car. As you found out, the cams have to come out in order to get the headbolts out. When you remove the exhaust cams, there's nothing but a little bit of oil to hold the shim buckets in place, so they are likely to fall out. It matters very much that they go back into the same position from which they came, as each shim is fitted to the exact length of the valve stem and gives the proper clearances. If dropped onto hard concrete, there is a very good chance of nicking them, which will undoubtedly cause them to stick in the bores.

What you'll want to do now, is have the machine shop set the clearances while the heads are there. They'll need to reinstall the cams and measure the clearances and find the correct thickness shim for that valve. Hopefully it's just 4 that fell out.....less hassle for choosing the correct shim.

It is very important to ensure the block deck is flat and clean, as well as the head surface. I believe it is way too much work to get this step done properly while the block is in the car. It would be best to yank the motor out and get all this stuff done where you have the room to pay attention and work. The extra 30min of work is well worth the headache. Wait until you need to torque things back together while it's in the car.......absolutely no fun at all.

Best of luck, but really consider pulling the motor out to complete this. A hoist shouldn't be that much to rent. There may even be a local scoob enthusiast who's got one you can borrow free. WI is a bit far for me to bring mine over..... :(

Jay Storm
Thanks for the advice, I will get the machine shop to check everything out for me and sort the shims out. I have a friend who will be able to help with removing the block and I will look at getting a hoist for tomorrow.
 

·
Registered
05 FXT 5MT
Joined
·
255 Posts
You will thank yourself for pulling it out. Can I suggest you reseal the oil separator plate and replace the rear main seal while you're in there? When I do headgaskets on an DOHC motor, I also take care of the following:

Cam seals
rear half moon seals (remove, clean and reseal)
rear oil separator plate reseal (replacing with metal if it still has the plastic part)
rear crank seal
front crank seal
remove oil pump and check backing plate for loose screws
replace waterpump (milage dependent)
inspect all t-belt idlers, replacing anything not absolutely solid
inspect tensioner assembly (if it takes less than 3 minutes to compress it, I replace it)
valve cover gaskets (including bolt seals)
inspect cam cap bolts for stretch (they are notorious for stretching and breaking)

It's alot more than necessary, but can be critical to keeping the motor running a long time.

Best of luck!
Jay
 

·
Registered
98 Forester
Joined
·
54 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
Dropped of the heads to the Machine shop today, they are going to rework the valve buckets and skim the heads. Next job find a Hoist. Anyone know where I can rent one in Madison WI?
 

·
Registered
98 Forester
Joined
·
54 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Can you tell me where the following are?

Cam seals
rear half moon seals (remove, clean and reseal)
rear oil separator plate reseal (replacing with metal if it still has the plastic part)
rear crank seal
front crank seal
remove oil pump and check backing plate for loose screws
valve cover gaskets (including bolt seals)
inspect cam cap bolts for stretch (they are notorious for stretching and breaking)
Thanks for any help.
 

·
Registered
05 FXT 5MT
Joined
·
255 Posts
Can you tell me where the following are?
Thanks for any help.
I'll do my best to explain it in red
after each item.

Cam seals 4 of them. 1 behind each cam pulley.
rear half moon seals (remove, clean and reseal) on the backside of the heads, inline with the camshafts.
rear oil separator plate reseal behind the flywheel, to the right .
rear crank seal behind the flywheel.
front crank seal behind the crank timing gear
remove oil pump and check backing plate for loose screws 5 phillips screws on the backside of the oilpump. A manual impact driver works good for loosening and loctite them before tightening.
valve cover gaskets (including bolt seals)Self explanitory
inspect cam cap bolts for stretch (they are notorious for stretching and breaking)Look at the threads for a narrow portion just before the base of the shoulder. This is where they snap.

Refer to a Haynes, Chiltons, or Factory Service Manual (FSM) before you get too far. There are important torque values and sequences to follow.
 

·
Registered
98 Forester
Joined
·
54 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
when removing the engine do I need to remove the AC Compressor? I currently have it pushed aside but it is still connected. Will this do? If I do need to remove it how do I discharge it?
 
1 - 20 of 25 Posts
Top