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2015 Impreza 5-Door Sport Auto (CVT)
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Below is the complete list of the best and worst vehicles as determined by the survey:

Best Scores
1. Toyota- 145
2. Ford- 120
3. Honda- 109
4. Chevrolet- 105
5. Tesla Motors- 88
6. Subaru- 87
7. Mercedes-Benz- 82
8. Volvo- 80
9. Cadillac- 78
10. BMW- 73

Worst Scores
1. Land Rover- 4
2. Maserati- 8
3. Jaguar- 9
4. Rolls-Royce- 11
5. Scion- 17
6. Ram- 17
7. Mini- 21
8. Mitsubishi- 21
9. Infiniti- 22
10. Jeep- 23

Read more at Best Car Brands According To 2014 Car-Brand Perception Survey

These are by preceptions only, not based on hard facts.
 

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2010 Forester
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Toyota up top but Scion at the bottom...Weird...

What an odd list.... Jeep is no surprise though....Chrysler needs to be at the bottom too IMO.
 

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2007 XT Sport 5MT
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That article is pointless... it's all based on a perception survey and has nothing to do with actual vehicle quality.
To quote straight from that page:
“The key word here is ‘perception,’ as influenced by word-of-mouth, marketing, and hands-on experience. Often, perception can be a trailing indicator, reflecting years of good or bad performance in a category, and it can also be swayed by headlines, such as Subaru and Tesla garnering awards, or brands being caught in widespread recalls, such as Honda, Jeep, and Toyota.”
 

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2005 Impreza RS 4EAT (sob)
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431 Posts
Yeah, where is Volkswagen on that list? Lol... considering that their goal is to be one of the top automakers by 2018 (something that I think would be cool)... this is a crappy survey. :p
 

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2014 Forester 2.0XT CVT
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181 Posts
I don't need to see a list saying Ford and Chevy are better, especially since I just bought a Subaru!
 

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2003 forestor XS
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6 Posts
When I owned a 98 a positve vote but my 03 is crappy. Subaru takes too long to rectify their mistakes and they are making each model larger with very modest power plants. Also they need to manage their dealerships better, at least here in Canada some of them suck.
 

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That article is pointless... it's all based on a perception survey and has nothing to do with actual vehicle quality.
To quote straight from that page:
It may have nothing to do with quality or reliability, but it is what drives sales. People don't buy cars based on scientific research, but based on how they "feel" about a brand.
 

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'19 Forester LTD CVT
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The list isn't scientific in any way, and consumer reports says that outright. They simply poll random samples and ask them how they "perceive" a certain brand having done no research. It isn't meant to say "Brand A is better than Brand B."

On the other hand, it gives a nice insight to how the average consumer sees things. MB is considered quality/reliable for many people, even though the are 15/26 for reliability according to CR. Also, for the first year, Subaru is perceived as the second safest brand (crash testing). Subaru has never been high on that list before, despite the actual safety accomplishments they have made.

In conclusions, it is more of a study looking at how bright (or not) consumers are....
 

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2010 Legacy GT LTD 6 spd
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The list isn't scientific in any way, and consumer reports says that outright. They simply poll random samples and ask them how they "perceive" a certain brand having done no research. It isn't meant to say "Brand A is better than Brand B."

On the other hand, it gives a nice insight to how the average consumer sees things. MB is considered quality/reliable for many people, even though the are 15/26 for reliability according to CR. Also, for the first year, Subaru is perceived as the second safest brand (crash testing). Subaru has never been high on that list before, despite the actual safety accomplishments they have made.

In conclusions, it is more of a study looking at how bright (or not) consumers are....

That last bit covers all you need to know about that list...that list matters not subaru is still has better sales growth than the others on the list.
 

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Also, for the first year, Subaru is perceived as the second safest brand (crash testing).
Subaru has done a great job exploiting crash tests results to present itself as a very safe car. But it a double-edged sword. One major mistake (safety recall) can result in a flood of lawsuits due to "misleading advertisement". Some car manufacturers have learned this lesson the hard way.

Subaru's real safety track is a mixed bag. If you look at historical fatality rates by car model, several Subaru models are worse than industry average for vehicle class. So crash tests and anecdotal evidence from brand fans tell only part of the story.

For example, industry average midsize sedan fatality rate is 51 death per 100,000 registered cars. Yet Legacy fatality rate is 83, second worse in the category. This is in spite of being "top safety pick" for years. For comparison, Accord is 19 (best in class) and Camry is 46.

Small SUV industry average fatality rate is 31. Forester is 45, again much worse than industry average. For comparison, CRV is 7 (outstanding) and RAV4 is 33.

In contrast, Mercedes Benz not only scores high in crash tests and has traditionally made safety one of its top priorities, they also consistently have among the lowest fatality rates in most vehicle categories. Other companies that consistently score high are Honda and Ford. Few people would think of Ford as above-average safety, yet they have among the lowest fatality rates in many vehicle categories. In spite of this pretty good track record Ford does not advertise safety a lot because in the past they were bitten pretty hard when safety claims backfired.

Net, crash tests are a good indicator, but only tell part of the story. And it is VERY RISKY to use safety in advertising, because it exposes you to HUGE financial liability. Misleading advertisement on gas mileage, like what Hyundai did, will cost you few hundred dollars per car. A lawsuit due to supposedly false safety claim can escalate into billions.
 

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2015 Impreza 5-Door Sport Auto (CVT)
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Subaru should be careful with their MPG claims.

They should state the maximum MPG will be attained only in warm weather...
 

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2005 Pontiac Vibe AWD 4 speed Auto
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Subaru has done a great job exploiting crash tests results to present itself as a very safe car. But it a double-edged sword. One major mistake (safety recall) can result in a flood of lawsuits due to "misleading advertisement". Some car manufacturers have learned this lesson the hard way.

Subaru's real safety track is a mixed bag. If you look at historical fatality rates by car model, several Subaru models are worse than industry average for vehicle class. So crash tests and anecdotal evidence from brand fans tell only part of the story.

For example, industry average midsize sedan fatality rate is 51 death per 100,000 registered cars. Yet Legacy fatality rate is 83, second worse in the category. This is in spite of being "top safety pick" for years. For comparison, Accord is 19 (best in class) and Camry is 46.

Small SUV industry average fatality rate is 31. Forester is 45, again much worse than industry average. For comparison, CRV is 7 (outstanding) and RAV4 is 33.

In contrast, Mercedes Benz not only scores high in crash tests and has traditionally made safety one of its top priorities, they also consistently have among the lowest fatality rates in most vehicle categories. Other companies that consistently score high are Honda and Ford. Few people would think of Ford as above-average safety, yet they have among the lowest fatality rates in many vehicle categories. In spite of this pretty good track record Ford does not advertise safety a lot because in the past they were bitten pretty hard when safety claims backfired.

Net, crash tests are a good indicator, but only tell part of the story. And it is VERY RISKY to use safety in advertising, because it exposes you to HUGE financial liability. Misleading advertisement on gas mileage, like what Hyundai did, will cost you few hundred dollars per car. A lawsuit due to supposedly false safety claim can escalate into billions.
Very interesting read. If you just look at crash test ratings, Subaru appears to be right at the head of the pack but looking at real world statistics, Subaru doesn't look near as good. The one stat that surprised me the most was for small SUV average fatality rate which is 31. Forester was 45, RAV 4-33 and CRV was only 7. How can there be such a difference between crash test ratings and actual safety in real world crashes? I thought Subaru was much safer than most brands, now after reading this, I'm not so sure.
 

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Very interesting read. If you just look at crash test ratings, Subaru appears to be right at the head of the pack but looking at real world statistics, Subaru doesn't look near as good. The one stat that surprised me the most was for small SUV average fatality rate which is 31. Forester was 45, RAV 4-33 and CRV was only 7. How can there be such a difference between crash test ratings and actual safety in real world crashes? I thought Subaru was much safer than most brands, now after reading this, I'm not so sure.
One thing that hurts Subaru is that they are popular in areas with bad winter driving conditions, increasing the overall number of accidents per 100,000 registered vehicles.

Another very important aspect that crash tests can't tell anything about is how good a vehicle is in helping the driver in preventing accidents before they occur. A vehicle that is easy to drive, with great handling, predictable and secure steering and good braking performance will help drivers to prevent accidents from happening in the first place, or will help him/her to mitigate the seriousness of the impact. A vehicle with questionable handling and quirky steering will be prone to have more accidents.

I have tested several Subaru models from different years and I never liked the steering / handling / braking performance. I think Subaru's driving has always been sub-par comparing to similar class vehicles. Hondas on the other hand have superb handling. The same can be told about Mercedes. Subaru may have great crash test results, but the driving characteristics are questionable.

Look at these three video of VSC tests.


Look how stable and sure-footed the RAV4 is during the emergency avoidance maneuver, and how "jumpy" the Forester is. The RAV4 does not over-steer, remains perfectly aligned with the original movement direction after the "S-maneuver" and is very, very stable. The driver's head barely moves. On the other hand, the Forester over-steers, displays very significant vertical and horizontal oscillations and the end direction is significantly off the original movement direction. The test is done on flat surface and with lots of open space. Now think about the same happening on a narrow two-way highway. Odds are that the RAV4 would have stayed on pavement, while the Forester would end up in the ditch.
 

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It may have nothing to do with quality or reliability, but it is what drives sales. People don't buy cars based on scientific research, but based on how they "feel" about a brand.
Is that a fact? Wait no, it isn't. While many people do buy a car based on perception, many also do their due diligence in researching their next purchase based on scientific facts. If no one did, there wouldn't be safety tests, motor trend awards, consumer reports recommendations, etc.. Many of these establishments use scientific facts to back their claims so I think your statement is quite off.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I have tested several Subaru models from different years and I never liked the steering / handling / braking performance. I think Subaru's driving has always been sub-par comparing to similar class vehicles. Hondas on the other hand have superb handling. The same can be told about Mercedes. Subaru may have great crash test results, but the driving characteristics are questionable.
You own a Honda?

Honda's are the foremost most boring vehicle on the road today.

Needless to say the above is your opinion and you opinion only.

The majority of those who own Subarus, including myself, think completely the opposite.
 

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The majority of those who own Subarus, including myself, think completely the opposite.
It doesn't matter what you think, statistics don't lie. Honda's fatality rate is several times lower than Subaru. Maybe Subaru is the preferred brand of really bad drivers.

And I don't own a Honda, BTW.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
It doesn't matter what you think, statistics don't lie. Honda's fatality rate is several times lower than Subaru. Maybe Subaru is the preferred brand of really bad drivers.

And I don't own a Honda, BTW.
No, you got it wrong, it's not what I think, it's the majority of what Subaru owners think :icon_wink:

I will take my chances in a Subaru rather than a very boring POS Honda...
 

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2007 XT Sport 5MT
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You own a Honda?
Honda's are the foremost most boring vehicle on the road today.
Needless to say the above is your opinion and you opinion only.
The majority of those who own Subarus, including myself, think completely the opposite.
It doesn't matter what you think, statistics don't lie. Honda's fatality rate is several times lower than Subaru.
And I don't own a Honda, BTW.
Calm down guys, if this keeps up I will close this thread.
 
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