[FozzieBalou]

The "shift points" in the newer CVTs aren't really newer - they're now just more pronounced.

On my 2014 SJ Forester, I can get "shift points" just by keeping my foot on the pedal and getting up in the revs... like if you want to get in front of a bunch of traffic at an intersection with a diminished lane count on the other side... or short highway onramps... But in normal driving - the CVT is just one smooth acceleration to my desired speed and there are no shift points you feel - but you will see fluctuations in the RPM on the tach and the CVT does what it's supposed to do - keep the engine in an optimal state of MPH vs MPG.

 

[FozzieBalou]

In a way - they do....

If you have an XT, then you have the shift paddles and you have the "S" and "I" functions on the steering wheel controls.

But either way, the CVT in at least the "first generation" of the SJ models (2014 - 2018) drive smoothly (no shifting) when you're not flooring the pedal... I can drive my 2014 non-XT model and if I keep the RPMs in the 2000 - 2500 range, I have no shift "points" going forward. But if I romp the go pedal and keep it pinned, I get shifts...

 

[FozzieBalou]

No confusion on my part - but you may be? Just because in one post you mention not having "fake shift points" in a newer Forester and in another you do have fake shift points.... That may just be word choice....

In your 2015 Forester, you do NOT have fake shift points UNLESS you are really accelerating swiftly - like going over 3000 RPM. Then the CVT controller will "shift" to a different ratio. If you drive it under 3000 RPM, it will be one smooth long pull from stop to desired speed. But if you push harder on the go-juice pedal, you get shifts.

Why? It may be a bit of engineering thought to keep you from having an engine and CVT go into full throttle mode and only go to a more "normal" RPM cruising speed when you reach your desired speed. This was a common complaint for many when driving CVT equipped vehicles (outside of Subaru models). I know when I was shopping, I drove a Jeep Patriot and a Jeep Compass (both CVT equipped) and was .. shocked? annoyed? pissed off? by the way it worked. You put your foot down and the revs climb and climb (relatively quickly) to over 4000 RPM (the engine roaring all the way) until I hit 40 MPH (or whatever) and let off the gas pedal. Even moderate gas pedal pressure resulted in the engine racing to power peak and staying there.

The Subaru CVT only raced to power peak when I was really pushing the pedal ... and then it "shifted" to a different ratio to keep the engine in a better position for power and use.

I think it was in 2016 or 2017 when the programming of the CVT was changed and the fake shift points were added to the CVT - and the main reason was because people that were coming from a "regular" transmission (with gears and all) were thinking something was wrong with their Foresters (and probably Outback and Crosstrek models, too) because they were expecting shifts and didn't get them. Later models (SK generation, 2019 until now) kept that fake shifting.

The XT models used a different CVT and had different programming due to the higher torque output of the turbo motor. That CVT has differnet programming to allow for 6 or 8 (depending on S-Drive choice) shift points. I think (I'd have to go read the owner's guide again) that also putting the gear selector in "M" (manual) mode OR using the paddle shifters will turn on that 8 "speed" gear ratios.

But again, drive it at lower RPMs (under about 3K) and you shouldn't feel those shift points UNLESS you're in manual mode or in the S-Drive (S+ ?) mode or using shift paddles.

 

[FozzieBalou]

For the Subaru CVT - it's been around since before the 2014 Forester (which I have) as it was in the Outback models for 2013 and maybe a year or two earlier. And I can't say I've had a lot of jerking or odd behavior when taking my foot off the gas or accelerating from a mid-speed (like 40 MPH). As CVTs are electronically and computer controlled, ther emay be times when traffic conditions will be different from what the computer "thinks" you're doing. The old Chrysler A604 transmission (called the Ultradrive, introduced in the early 90s as their first electronically controlled transaxle. When you'd be slowing down (for traffic or a light) and suddnely able to accelerate (light turns green, traffic moves, whatever) the transmission would jerk as it went from coasting in 4th/overdrive to engaging 1st or (more often) 2nd gear to accelerate away. The CVT has some similar actions depending on how you hit the gas pedal.

As to the Dodge Caliber - remember that it originally was a replacement for the soon to be discontinued PT Cruiser and Dodge Neon compacts. The CVT was from JATCO (same as many Nissans of the era). The original Compass/Patriot twins used that same transmission. When I test drove the Compass back then, it was very rubber-band, yes, but just seemed to peg the motor when I was accelerating.

 

[FozzieBalou]

Yes, the CVT was also available in the small Justy sub-compact back in the 90s and continued in the JDM for many years after being pulled from the US.... Subaru brought the CVT back to the US with the 5th gen Legacy/Outback in 2010 and on the JDM Exiga models.

It is a solid and reliable unit for sure.

To touch on the viability of a MT vs AT - remember that Porsche had nearly stopped using a manual transmission with the advent and availability of their excellent PDK transmission that - much as Black21 noted with his Shadow/Sundance comparison - was as fast (and often faster) than the manual models. Yes, I get that some feel that they can only "connect" with their vehicle with a manual transmission, but as Black21 also pointed out - there are many out here that do not/can not/will not drive a manual transmission and if you only have a manual, you're quite possibly stuck.