('14+) Which motor oil do you use? - Page 3 - Subaru Forester Owners Forum
User Tag List

 31Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #31 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-10-2017, 03:56 AM
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Colorado
Posts: 487
Car Year: 2006
Car Model: FXT
Transmission: 5MT
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
I changed the oil four times a year in my 2.5RS, Mobile 5000 10W30 in the summer, 5W30 in the winter. Sold it with 252,000 miles and it was making no noises and using no oil. My 06 XT gets three changes a year at about 4500 miles with Rotella T6 5W40. Oil use is harder to quantify with a turbo motor, as mine uses more oil the more I'm in boost, and none (with an AOS) if I drive it like an old lady. Before it had the OAS, consumption was excessive, as the original owner took poor care of the car and most likely damaged one of the pistons, although I can find no evidence on the spark plugs. As for the super light oils that are all the rage, I'm not buying it. I think they're just like a 2000 RPM cold idle...bad for the car, better for emissions. 5W30 is the lightest I'll go, and only in the winter on a healthy motor. I also don't believe that conventional oil is worth the cost anymore, synthetic is a few bucks more a gallon and allows longer intervals while maintaining viscosity. I'm actually at the point with my Dakota that I'm only changing the oil once a year with synthetic. It only sees about 5K a year, and with 9 months on the current oil, it's still fresh looking. Just turned 200K last weekend.

OldGoat38 likes this.
DoubleJ is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #32 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-10-2017, 04:11 AM
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NJ
Posts: 1,514
Car Year: 2004
Car Model: FXT
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by John L. View Post
I was used to Valvoline Hi-Mileage oil in my jeep cherokee before it died (after nearly 20 years service.) I was going to use this now as these oils also have higher detergency and anti-wear protection. Then I read a web article by the owner of a Subaru-specializing repair shop Being very happy now with my 2017i Forester I was surprised to learn he attributes massive head gasket deterioration in some Subarus from gasket softeners used in such oils to seal leaks. So I will now probably return to Castrol GTX 5W-30 mixed with their full synthetic. I have no intention of using 0w-20 past my break-in oil change just because the government is dictating Subaru mandate it, as I have seen there is a considerable difference in anti-wear oil tests versus 5w-30 if you ever got into trouble (such as with an overheat.) I have permission from the dealer to do my own oil changes (though little else.) I will use their filters purchased wholesale on Amazon, and have to deal with the viscosity spec if it comes up, I doubt they will screw me on the warranty. (But I don't blame those of you who want to use 0w20 to avoid this risk.) Just stay away from Hi-Mileage oils in Subarus!

John L.


Blaming High Mileage oil for inferior head gasket material? That's a new one. Do you have a link to the article?

And where have you seen considerable difference in anti-wear oil tests in 0W20 vs 5W30? I'd be interested in that as well.

Thanks

DockingPilot likes this.

2004 PSM FXT
bluesubie is offline  
post #33 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-10-2017, 07:33 AM
Forum Member
 
3 boxers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: West MI
Posts: 555
Car Year: 2010
Car Model: FXT
Transmission: slush-box
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Blackstone

If you're going to use a different oil than recommended, get a used oil analysis done. Different companies do this. I happen to use Blackstone.

After agonizing over many "which oil to use" threads here and on bob the oil guy's site, I've had good results with 2:

5W30 Quaker State Ultimate Durability Synthetic, and
0W30 Castrol Syntec A3B4

Even though one uses calcium and the other magnesium, they both had lot's of life left, even after 5000 miles (used to change at 3k miles because of modded engine).

One caveat: although I and others on this thread are trying to be helpful, data from different generations of engines may not transfer well. My data is SH, I've seen SJ also on this thread.

Perhaps someone with a '14+ has some used oil analysis data?

Jeff
3 boxers is offline  
 
post #34 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-10-2017, 09:12 AM
Forum Member
 
KangaBanga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Brisbane Australia
Posts: 127
Car Year: 2015
Car Model: Subaru Forester
Transmission: Auto CVT
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanPD View Post
Not being a mechanic, I'm partial to following what the manual says. Conventional wisdom tells me that if I've followed the instructions and something goes wrong, they can't say I didn't do what they said. I've got 3 Foz's (04, 12, and 15). For my 2015 2.5i, the manual says:

0W-20 synthetic is the required oil for optimum engine performance and protection. Conventional oil may be used if synthetic oil is unavailable.
*: If 0W-20 synthetic oil is not available, 5W-30 or 5W-40 conventional oil may be used if replenishment is needed but should be changed to 0W-20 synthetic oil at the next oil change.

JMHO
The Japanese manual states that oils from 0w20 ,5w30, 0w30,5w40 are all suitable for the NA 2.5 with 0w20 not for turbos.

So there ya go, the original specs ;)

Conventional wisdom tells us obviously the books been changed for emission standards in usa ;)

Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk

Love my Foz!!!
KangaBanga is offline  
post #35 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-10-2017, 09:49 AM
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Sleepy Hollow NY
Posts: 16
Car Year: 2017
Car Model: Forester 2.5i
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
The forum computer is refusing me from posting links! Unbelievable. However the website is 540 RAT Tech Facts Not Myths, google an thou shalt find. There are exceptions, Castrol Edge 5w-20 is quite high there, but this is not a 0w-20. I do not have the link to the mechanic claiming Hi Mileage oils can weaken head gaskets, but will avoid them as there is plenty else good out there to use.
Thank you, KangaBanga. That is pretty much what I figured here in New York. John L.
John L. is offline  
post #36 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-10-2017, 09:01 PM
Forum Member
 
KangaBanga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Brisbane Australia
Posts: 127
Car Year: 2015
Car Model: Subaru Forester
Transmission: Auto CVT
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by John L. View Post
The forum computer is refusing me from posting links! Unbelievable. However the website is 540 RAT Tech Facts Not Myths, google an thou shalt find. There are exceptions, Castrol Edge 5w-20 is quite high there, but this is not a 0w-20. I do not have the link to the mechanic claiming Hi Mileage oils can weaken head gaskets, but will avoid them as there is plenty else good out there to use.
Thank you, KangaBanga. That is pretty much what I figured here in New York. John L.
No worries mate! Just sharing my research. As I decided to do all the basic servicing myself. Took me quite a while to find a copy of the Japanese foz manual online. I then used Google translate on the contents. It also comes with all the other recommended stuff for the other fluids .

Our Aussie foz are direct Japan imports so I figured whatever the original Jap manual recommends should be the standard, since all the engines come from there. Over here the recommendation is also for 0w20 for NA 2.5i. the local subaru 0w20 oil is made by castrol which is just a group 3 oil with no moly at all. The real Subaru 0w20 synth in jp from what I read is made by idemitsu. And they also have a 0w30 full synth which is recommended for their new levorg cars.

Imho 0w20 is not warranted unless running in freezing temps or doing lots of cold start short distance driving.

The older forester models often have the head gasket problem which I reckon is not caused by the motor oil but rather cheap parts, just like the recent oil burn from low quality piston rings. Subaru also uses cheap thin paint and front windscreen. But in the latest model the windscreen is now a thicker type.

P.s. emmission standards have also caused zinc to be much reduced in most motor oils to get to ilsac GF5 standards. Personally I think good stuff like moly and zinc zddp should be retained in oils.

Anyways most of our discussion will be irrelevant in a few years time if electric vehicles become the norm.

Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk

Love my Foz!!!
KangaBanga is offline  
post #37 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 04:27 AM
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NJ
Posts: 1,514
Car Year: 2004
Car Model: FXT
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Which motor oil do you use?

Quote:
Originally Posted by John L. View Post
The forum computer is refusing me from posting links! Unbelievable. However the website is 540 RAT Tech Facts Not Myths, google an thou shalt find. There are exceptions, Castrol Edge 5w-20 is quite high there, but this is not a 0w-20. I do not have the link to the mechanic claiming Hi Mileage oils can weaken head gaskets, but will avoid them as there is plenty else good out there to use.
Thank you, KangaBanga. That is pretty much what I figured here in New York. John L.


The 540 Rat tests are debunked on a weekly basis at bobistheoilguy.com. Long story short is that those "tests" are not performed on equipment that mean anything about how an oil will perform in an engine.

Comments by Shannow are particularly informative.

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ub...pics/3966884/1
3 boxers likes this.

2004 PSM FXT
bluesubie is offline  
post #38 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 04:40 AM
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NJ
Posts: 1,514
Car Year: 2004
Car Model: FXT
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by KangaBanga View Post
The Japanese manual states that oils from 0w20 ,5w30, 0w30,5w40 are all suitable for the NA 2.5 with 0w20 not for turbos.

So there ya go, the original specs ;)

Conventional wisdom tells us obviously the books been changed for emission standards in usa ;)

Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk


The problem is not just emission standards but Corporate Average Fuel Economy requirements. Manufacturers face huge fines for not meeting the minimum mpg requirements. So if a 0W20 provides 1% better fuel economy, Subaru of America will recommend it because it can add up to big $$$$ when you multiply that by how many cars are sold in the U.S.

For n/a Subaru's driven in street conditions, 0W20 works just fine and there are plenty of uoa's out there to back this up. The problem is turbo's.

This old post at nasioc has some very good info about CAFE:

https://forums.nasioc.com/forums/sho....php?t=1526329
Change_agent likes this.

2004 PSM FXT
bluesubie is offline  
post #39 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 06:32 AM
Forum Member
 
dave5358's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: North Bend
Posts: 3,255
Car Year: 2006
Car Model: XT
Transmission: 4EAT
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesubie View Post
The problem is not just emission standards but Corporate Average Fuel Economy requirements. Manufacturers face huge fines for not meeting the minimum mpg requirements. So if a 0W20 provides 1% better fuel economy, Subaru of America will recommend it because it can add up to big $$$$ when you multiply that by how many cars are sold in the U.S.

For n/a Subaru's driven in street conditions, 0W20 works just fine and there are plenty of uoa's out there to back this up. The problem is turbo's.
Well said ^^^^^. For both Average Fuel Economy and emissions, the vehicle is started from cold and driven through a "standard course" - city driving, stop-start, highway driving, etc. The exact details of the course aren't important . . . but the cold start is. Subaru added Secondary Air Injection and TGVs - both of which switch off and do absolutely nothing after a minute or so - to cut down cold start emissions. Ditto for using lighter weight oil. Oil warms up slowly - more slowly than coolant - and the whole test might be over before the oil reaches maximum operating temperature.

Occasionally, a forum user suggests letting the vehicle warm up before driving off. Good idea, IMHO. But warming up would be the 'kiss of death' for both emissions and fuel economy. It's sort of like standardized testing in schools . . . the teachers start teaching the stuff that's on the standard test. A significant part of car design is to get the best scores on economy and emissions testing. How about the clever approach used by Volkswagen . . . sort of like that clever kid who figured out how to cheat on the standard tests ;-)

BoxerFest 2015 Best Custom License Plate: EVO LOL
dave5358 is offline  
post #40 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 06:40 AM
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: ES
Posts: 67
Car Year: 2017
Car Model: Forester 2.0D CVT
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Talking about XT and diesel engines, could be a problem use a 0W30 instead of a 5W30 and vice versa? Is not better for the engine a minor viscosity on cold starts? At working temperature the viscosity supposed to be the same in both oils, isn't it?

kutavyz is offline  
post #41 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 08:17 AM
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Rocky Point, NC
Posts: 2
Car Year: 2017
Car Model: Forester Touring
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by subarumatty View Post
I used to be a Mobil 1 diehard fan. But these days, I have a new philosophy, based on my Toyota cars: do what the manufacturer says. As for Subaru and oil changes, it says to take it to the dealer and let them replace the oil with 0W-20 synthetic. Ok fine. Also, I have 2 years free maintenance. But, what oil do you guys use? Is it OK to use Mobil 1? Am I a fool for paying money for oil when the dealer will do it for free? Thanks for any advice!
Changed engine oil after only 500 miles, to replace the "Subaru" oil (Idemitsu is the actual manufacturer) with AmsOil Signature Series 0W-20. Reason: Idemitsu oil has a relatively high vaporization rate- almost 40% higher than AmsOil. That's why Idemitsu synthetic has a change cycle of 6,000 miles and AmsOil's is 25,000 miles or one year. The industry measure for vaporization is the NOACK number. Worth noting that Mobil 1 and Castrol won't disclose their NOACK number, but it can be inferred from their change cycle of 15,000 miles. Got the AmsOil at "wholesale" since my son has an account with them. No sales tax, and if the order is large enough, no shipping. Will change to AmsOil Signature Series 5W-30 for May15-Oct 15. It gets pretty hot in Wilmington, NC and 0W-20 seems a too light.


"The NOACK Volatility Test, otherwise known as ASTM D-5800, determines the evaporation loss of lubricants in high-temperature service.[1] The more motor oils vaporize, the thicker and heavier they become, contributing to poor circulation, reduced fuel economy and increased oil consumption, wear and emissions." Source: Wikipedia.

Could not drain all the engine oil out using my Pela vacuum pump. Drained the rest out (about 2 quarts) through the oil pan drain (after my screw up with the CVT drain.) There apparently is a little sump in the oil pan that the Pela tube can't reach. Engine oil drain plug is accessed by removing a small oval, plastic panel secured by 4 fasteners, only one of which is threaded - the others are expansion type tabs. Saw Kanga Banga's note re fumoto oil change valve; ordered one.

Last edited by emsai; 01-11-2017 at 09:39 AM.
emsai is offline  
post #42 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 10:01 AM
Forum Member
 
dave5358's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: North Bend
Posts: 3,255
Car Year: 2006
Car Model: XT
Transmission: 4EAT
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by kutavyz View Post
Talking about XT and diesel engines, could be a problem use a 0W30 instead of a 5W30 and vice versa? Is not better for the engine a minor viscosity on cold starts? At working temperature the viscosity supposed to be the same in both oils, isn't it?
Yes and yes. But some oil companies use different base stocks and/or additive packs on the 0w- oils as opposed to their 5w- products. So, there may be significant differences between the two oil products that is not revealed by the numbers. Unless you live at the north pole, it may not make that much difference in practice.

BoxerFest 2015 Best Custom License Plate: EVO LOL
dave5358 is offline  
post #43 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 12:39 PM
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Sleepy Hollow NY
Posts: 16
Car Year: 2017
Car Model: Forester 2.5i
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
I do not know how anyone can say anything is debunked on "Bobistheoilguy" when every time I go there I see dozens of different opinions about an issue. The Rat-540 tests also proved out when several individuals posted how they had complete cooling system failure for a limited time with no engine damage, attributed to some ultra high anti-wear tested oils, so go there, read how the tests were done, I think you will reach your own conclusion. But I just reviewed the engine breakin thread on the BITOG site, and nothing is changed, many all different opinions. Who is debunking whom?
After reading most of the posts here, all I know is I am doing my breakin oil change soon and my car is never seeing 0w-20 again. I have never forgiven the federal government when they took most of the zinc out of the oils and many of us former Jeep owners with flat tappet cams suffered thousands of dollars repair costs. I only escaped because I was using a premium synthetic blend oil, but some of my friends got nailed! Now the oils have new things like elevated moly and boron, zinc is no longer as relevant. But I have learned the government doesn't give a damn about how long my new truck lasts. I do. And I appreciate the clarity on the rediculous 2000 rpm cold idle given in the post above, I intend to terminate this by putting the parking brake on for a CVT shift into drive right away after starting. A brief warmup, and I'm off. At 12 degrees F. out this fast idle again makes no common sense at all, except to a federal enviromentalist. John L.
John L. is offline  
post #44 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 12:53 PM
Forum Member
 
DockingPilot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NJ
Posts: 590
Car Year: 2017
Car Model: Forester Touring
Transmission: CVT
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Which motor oil do you use?

I hear ya on the gov intrusion thing John L and agree. ( thats about to change hopefully)
But regarding the 0w20 and BTOG, see any bad UOA's on it yet ?
I haven't ben able to find anything myself.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
DockingPilot is offline  
post #45 of 85 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 02:23 PM
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Sleepy Hollow NY
Posts: 16
Car Year: 2017
Car Model: Forester 2.5i
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
I am probably going to return to Castrol GTX with 20-25% their full synthetic mixed in, this served me many years in my Jeep, and Castrol will take 4 cylinder engine torture in the Subaru now. I trust Valvoline too. Both excel on the anti-wear tests in both 5w20 and 5w30 grades, so if you want a 20w there you go. John L.
John L. is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Subaru Forester Owners Forum > Technical Forums and Vehicle Assistance > Problems, Maintenance, and Warranty

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 

Title goes here

close
video goes here
description goes here. Read Full Story
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome
 


Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.1