Over-Advanced Timing - Subaru Forester Owners Forum
User Tag List

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 10:12 PM Thread Starter
Smooshed FOTY 2011
 
Blue Fox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Durango, Colorado
Posts: 5,439
Car Year: 2005
Car Model: Lifted 2.5 XT
Transmission: 5-Speed MT
Over-Advanced Timing

Need to bounce my thinking off a couple of people to make sure it makes sense.

I got a P0011 and a P0021 codes (Intake camshaft position/timing over-advanced) about a week ago, and the car feels like it's towing something huge (down on power). Had the turbo checked, fine. Checked the timing just a few hours ago, and I want to make sure I'm not "under" thinking things here.

Below are pictures of the critical timing marks. The intake/exhaust cam pulley marks and the crankshaft mark. Now, the intake/exhaust marks line up perfectly to one another and to the timing belt cover marks as well, so those are fine. What doesn't line up is the crankshaft mark (it looks like it's retarded by 2 or 3 teeth).

So the conclusion I have come to is that the timing belt skipped two or three teeth on the crankshaft sprocket alone (causing it to be retarded, and the intake/exhaust cams to be advanced). And since the exhaust cams do not have position sensors (only the intake cams do), that's the reason it's throwing up both codes only, correct?








2004 XT - RIP
2005 XT - 5MT - 2" LIFT JOURNAL
Blue Fox is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 03:52 AM
Simply the best
Contributing Member
 
The Rookie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Warwickshire, UK
Posts: 8,588
Car Year: 99
Car Model: UK S-turbo
It certainly looks like that is what has happened, yes.

Simon

98 s-turbo now breaking for spares :icon_cry:, now driving a BMW 320D M-sport :raspberry:
The Rookie is offline  
post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 06:39 AM
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Evansville, IN
Posts: 1,543
Car Year: 05
Car Model: FXT
Sure sounds like it. Any idea why it jumped? Did you tach it out recently or is your tensioner bad?
Hardrvin is offline  
post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 12:29 PM Thread Starter
Smooshed FOTY 2011
 
Blue Fox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Durango, Colorado
Posts: 5,439
Car Year: 2005
Car Model: Lifted 2.5 XT
Transmission: 5-Speed MT
No idea why it jumped. Tensioner is new (about 5000 miles ago). Was sitting at a stop light, engine stuttered and immediately got the CEL codes.

I will say that earlier in the day, I was cleaning my car out from all the mud from when I fell into that mud pit. I'm thinking that the combo of me spraying out the engine bay, combined with the amount of mud that was in there had something to do with it, I'm sure.

A local tuner of mine said that the max the belt can skip is 4 teeth before it'll start smacking valves, glad it only looks like it's 2 or 3.

2004 XT - RIP
2005 XT - 5MT - 2" LIFT JOURNAL
Blue Fox is offline  
post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 12:40 PM
Contributing Member
 
ferret's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Northern NJ
Posts: 3,356
Car Year: 2014
Car Model: Impreza Ltd
Transmission: CVT
If it happens again, I would look into putting the timing belt guide in place ( item 6 in the illustration below ). It's on the M/T cars due to the quick change in engine RPM when shifting. This can cause the belt to jump a tooth or two. Automatics are not supposed to be prone to this phenomena. But with increase HP, I guess anything is possible.

Camshaft and timing belt ? Illustration #1, Subaru FORESTER ? Subaru parts catalog

98S, 2014 Impreza 5 dr Ltd (9 Subaru's since 1978, 7 were 5 sp) ILuvSubaru's
ferret is offline  
post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 02:12 PM Thread Starter
Smooshed FOTY 2011
 
Blue Fox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Durango, Colorado
Posts: 5,439
Car Year: 2005
Car Model: Lifted 2.5 XT
Transmission: 5-Speed MT
^^ Yeah, I was wondering why mine didn't have that, don't know why they just didn't put it on all models.

On a side note, the crankshaft sprocket, and a few other ones had impacted mud in the grooves that I literally had to scrape out with a screwdriver, so I'm pretty sure that's the cause of the belt jumping.

Who knew submerging their car in liquified mud halfway up their headlamps is bad for the timing belt?

2004 XT - RIP
2005 XT - 5MT - 2" LIFT JOURNAL
Blue Fox is offline  
post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 02:23 PM
Forum Member
 
brad84's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: San Jose (Used to be in OR)
Posts: 237
Car Year: 2004
Car Model: Forester XT
Transmission: 5spd
I think I might be having the same problem. Is there a HOWTO on how to fix this?

I would like to do it myself instead of going to the dealer.
brad84 is offline  
post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 09:14 PM
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Evansville, IN
Posts: 1,543
Car Year: 05
Car Model: FXT
^ hehe, if you're asking here, I'd suggest finding someone local to help you. You should be able to find the shop manual online and it spells it out, but it can be somewhat confusing to a first timer.
Hardrvin is offline  
post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 10:19 PM Thread Starter
Smooshed FOTY 2011
 
Blue Fox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Durango, Colorado
Posts: 5,439
Car Year: 2005
Car Model: Lifted 2.5 XT
Transmission: 5-Speed MT
FIXED.

Just took the timing belt off, and re-installed it using the Subaru manual. The belt indeed skipped 2 teeth on the crankshaft sprocket. Re-installed the belt and made sure the tooth count was correct between the marks.

The Subaru manual was a huge help with being very straight forward and showing very nifty pictures which explained how the belt goes on the sprockets (and how the marks like up with the belt at any given mark), and it's running perfectly.

2004 XT - RIP
2005 XT - 5MT - 2" LIFT JOURNAL
Blue Fox is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Subaru Forester Owners Forum > Technical Forums and Vehicle Assistance > Engine and Exhaust > EJ25 - 2.5L Turbocharged (2004-2013)

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Subaru Forester Owners Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome