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Old 11-28-2012, 07:42 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Aaron'z 2.5RS/WRX View Post
But is the difference in 1-2" of wire, worth even mentioning?

No...
Depends entirely on how long the wire is that you're taking 1-2" from and what you consider "worth mentioning."
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Old 11-28-2012, 07:44 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Wessneroo View Post
Depends entirely on how long the wire is that you're taking 1-2" from and what you consider "worth mentioning."
In this context... Is it worth mentioning....


No...
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Old 11-28-2012, 08:01 AM   #18 (permalink)
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How many micro-ohms does your inch or 2 account for??

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Old 11-28-2012, 09:02 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by dirtroadrunner View Post
Anyone with the grounding kit notice a reduction in the greenish-white powder (corrosion?) buildup around the battery? I have to clean mine every month or two, which is kind of annoying because every other car I've ever owned never had that crap grow on the battery. The terminals are cleaned, greased, etc and I still get it.

I may put together a grounding kit this weekend. My lights dim when I run the power windows all of the time.
If you have corrosion on a wet battery, the battery may be gassing due to the water level being too low, causing the battery is boil when charging. In addition, as the plate surface is exposed to air, the battery capacity is reduced... perhaps the reason why your lights dim under heavy load conditions?

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Old 11-28-2012, 09:12 AM   #20 (permalink)
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I suggest doing this before investing money into a gounding kit.
  • Inspect all the grounding points.
  • Remove the wire lug or push-on connector, clean off any corrosion, coat with dielectric grease & tighten back in place.
Most grounding issues can be be corrected at no cost... just your time, by doing this. Nothing wrong with adding additional grounding, but do the above first to see if it makes a difference.

Here's a link to a previous grounding thread. Do it yourself grounding kit

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Old 11-28-2012, 10:18 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Anybody know of anybody that did this on a 2011 Foz with the FB25 engine?? :)
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Old 11-28-2012, 10:25 AM   #22 (permalink)
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The grounding issues were mostly in the earlier Foresters & not a common problem on the later... newer Forester, as the factory corrected much of the earlier issues.

Still... nothing wrong with adding more grouding. We add some on both our Foresters. We opted for the "stealth" installation, blending the added grounding with the factory wiring to make it like it was always there.

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Old 11-28-2012, 10:30 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Makes sense 2.5x, I could swap out the factory grounds for seemingly stock ones that are superior :)
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Old 11-28-2012, 12:57 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron'z 2.5RS/WRX View Post
How many micro-ohms does your inch or 2 account for??
I originally posted to defend the assertion that length does indeed play a role in resistance. That is all. The difference between 9 and 10 femto-ohms vs 9 and 10 giga-ohms is different in this context. But a 10% reduction in resistance is universal to any context. That's all I was getting at.
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Old 11-28-2012, 01:43 PM   #25 (permalink)
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awesome post.

here was mine that i did pretty much as soon as i got my forester.

Grounding Wires Installed

i ground every car that i have. it works wonders. some people say no, but i disagree.

on my other car on the infiniti forums i sell my kits to the members and they love them.
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Old 11-30-2012, 02:37 PM   #26 (permalink)
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It's not unusual for the grounds connected to the battery to fail with age. Usually it's a corrosion issue. Replacing the ground from the battery to the body and another directly to the engine block is more than adequate. Good quality cabling with adequate stranding and guage is important. Thorough cleaning of the connection points is very important too!

What I see in this photo spread is total overkill. Remember the engine is made primarily of aluminum and steel. Electrons pass through the metal engine components with much less resistance than through those jumpers. My guess is that someone will chime in that copper has better conductivity than either aluminum or steel. True, but the total mass of the engine metals is so comparatively large that it ends up being far more conductive than the relatively small copper wires. Both aluminum and steel are reliable conductors as well. At least 99% of the power utility wiring on towers, poles and underground is made up of a combination of the two. Silver powder is often used at critical connection points in substations and busswork. This would be total overkill on a car. Dielectric paste will help prevent corrosion though.
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Old 11-30-2012, 04:00 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm View Post
It's not unusual for the grounds connected to the battery to fail with age. Usually it's a corrosion issue. Replacing the ground from the battery to the body and another directly to the engine block is more than adequate. Good quality cabling with adequate stranding and guage is important. Thorough cleaning of the connection points is very important too!

What I see in this photo spread is total overkill. Remember the engine is made primarily of aluminum and steel. Electrons pass through the metal engine components with much less resistance than through those jumpers. My guess is that someone will chime in that copper has better conductivity than either aluminum or steel. True, but the total mass of the engine metals is so comparatively large that it ends up being far more conductive than the relatively small copper wires. Both aluminum and steel are reliable conductors as well. At least 99% of the power utility wiring on towers, poles and underground is made up of a combination of the two. Silver powder is often used at critical connection points in substations and busswork. This would be total overkill on a car. Dielectric paste will help prevent corrosion though.
Mostly agree. The problems are these:

AlO2 is a poor conductor at both DC and RF. It starts to form almost instantly (a feature we take advantage of) and protects the metal underneath. If you really want to keep Al-Al or Al-Cu joints happy, use Penetrox A13 (the high temp stuff for under the hood). NoAlox is another but I can't find it's drip point. Both use zinc powder in grease (organic or silicone). Use gloves and old clothes, the stuff will NOT wash out.

I can tell you from both a DC and RF ground standpoint, most cars can stand better connections between the block and the body. Some alternators assume the mounting bracket makes a good return path (my 05 wrx has it's own return). My experience is that's a bad assumption after a few years (bad being somewhat relative).

Once you get a good tinned copper braid between the block and the body and between the battery and the body, most everything bolted directly to the block should be good. That being said, I've pulled steel bolts out of Al castings and seen horrible corrosion where the prep wasn't done right. Using a DVM with one lead on the pos battery terminal and the other on the neg., check your voltage. Then, using the meter's neg lead, poke at the various ground points. More than a few tenths of a volt different would make me curious.

Last edited by mtnredhed; 11-30-2012 at 04:04 PM. Reason: clear up test point
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:04 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pleiad7 View Post
That looks like a nice kit, but one thing I would recommend is to reduce the slack in the wires as much as possible. The shorter the individual pieces, the better.
Also should have used black or green cable.
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:08 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nthads View Post
does anyone know where to get the high temp woven ribbon cable? iv seen several cars stock using this type of grounding and im thinking it might be a cleaner and less apt to fail from heat and will provide a pretty solid grounding path...yet probably susceptible to corrosion?..... but anyways....any thoughts?
NAPA and O'Reilys has it.
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Old 12-01-2012, 03:04 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Grounding kits are not something new. These have been around for a long time and they are proven to work very well. Some friends of mine had tested the effectiveness of the additional grounding with a before and after test on a stage 2 STI on their Mustang dyno. They measured 2 additional horsepower after adding a grounding kit with 6 added grounding wires. I have been using a 6 wire grounding kit for 3 years. I have also not had and negative battery terminal corrosion since adding the additional grounding. Most cars are under-grounded from the factory and will benefit from a properly executed grounding kit! Nice job on yours OP.
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